hypocricy and lies? lol! most of your own country's ideals are built from america's.......still wanna make that statement?

I was raised Roman Catholic, I was very devout up until my father died.

No offense to you guys but it really doesnt matter if there is a god or isnt. God isnt just something that controlls the world around us. it was a hope to people in need. How many times have you ever hoped to god or prayed its just the notion that there is a greater power out there that watches over us. Religion has drived some to persevere and some to kill, that is more important than god existing

[quote="Old Reliable":f7343]hypocricy and lies? lol! most of your own country's ideals are built from america's.......still wanna make that statement?[/quote:f7343]
Actually, if they were built from anyone's, it would be Great Britain (HINT: Look at the Top-left corner of the NZ flag oOo: )

Im basing that statement on the fact that the decleration of independence, the document for which your country foundered itself, is just a foolish contradictory document.

"All men are created equal."

HAH! Yeah, so the 400,000 slaves in the country at that time WEREN'T men?

Sure, my country has made mistakes, like any country...But we don't celebrate them.

if it were built from great britain's, then you would be ruled by a king or queen, is that so?

Different times Trip, different times.

We celebrate mistakes? no one told me. eek:

[quote="Old Reliable":05cc3]hypocricy and lies? lol! most of your own country's ideals are built from america's.......still wanna make that statement? [/quote:05cc3]

I can't believe that anyone could be so cocky.

Tripper, you're cool and everything, but you're a god damn fool.

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First off, our country was founded on the Articles of Confederation, which didn't work out well and then we established the Decleration of Independence.

But I do agree with you about the slave part. I could write an essay on why we allowed slaves in our country after the American Revolution...

Have you ever heard of Amendments?? These so called "Amendments" is what keeps our country what it is today. Ever heard of the 13th, 14th, and 15th Amendment? Huh? These Amendments freed slaves and gave them the right to vote and be a citizen of the US of A.

I know we've made mistakes, but we later fixed them. So don't go off preaching shit about us being based on "complete lies and hipocracy".

[quote="pfc Green":d5961]Different times Trip, different times.[/quote:d5961]

Yeah. My point still stands...That doesn't change anything.

[quote="Pfc Green":d5961]We celebrate mistakes? no one told me. [/quote:d5961]

You celebrate the 4th of july don't you? Sure you're celebrating independence. But you're also celebrating the ideals of men who thought slavery was just.

well if you really want to get down to that and try and change history, go ahead

That's all I meant about the lies and hypocracy thing. I was refering to merely slavery. Nothing else.

Some of you are so blindly patriotic. At least you can admit some things.

Im not saying my ancestors were angels...They were british too.


I always wonder why americans didn't abolish slavery when the british did.

hey we all have our own beliefs, just because you celebrate the 4th of july doesnt mean you support slavery

[quote=Tripper]Yeah. My point still stands...That doesn't change anything.

[quote="Pfc Green":de8c0]We celebrate mistakes? no one told me. [/quote:de8c0]

You celebrate the 4th of july don't you? Sure you're celebrating independence. But you're also celebrating the ideals of men who thought slavery was just.[/quote:de8c0]

Man I did'nt know you were so anti-U.S., anyway We are celebrating Independence ONLY not slavery. When the U.S. became indepented slavery was still a common practice around the world (it still is in some places) and was a generally accepted practice, true we kept the practice going far to long (infact we should have ended it when we gained independence) Your point is'nt valid, the times do have major bearing on the situation.

slavery was just the way it was in the 1700's and 1800's... it was the way they lived their lives back then... sure it was wrong and thats why our nation has changed...

seriouslly, you patriotic americans need to get that pickle out of your ass and figure out that half the shit you say is bullshit

you are not perfect...Tripper is more right about your shit thenyou guys think you are.

No one here said we were perfect, the U.S. is very far from it.

lol and this comes from a a teenaged canadian who would never say that to my face

the problem would be if you cared...why would you care if I said that

You would punch me for having an opinion...is that the american way?

no, your opinion means nothing

I pledge alligence to the flag blah blah blah

Let me guess now it would be valid.

whats your point, what are you trying to accomplish?

he's just being a smartass

[quote:7f2fa]slavery was just the way it was in the 1700's and 1800's... it was the way they lived their lives back then... sure it was wrong and thats why our nation has changed... [/quote:7f2fa]

Hmmm, okay. So why did Americans accept slavery long after the British had abolished it?

My original point was, and still is:

The Decleration Of Independence, for which your nation largely bases its independence on is a hypocritical document.

There is nothing Anti-American about that.....At all. All countries have their faults. I was just questioning why some Americans can't admit their faults like the rest of us. Is it becaused they are brainwashed? Could be.

See if you had said it like that, I would have agreed right off the bat. When it comes to the equality thing it is hypocritical. You just presented your points pretty harshly and they sounded more emotional than factual.

because people don't like to change, if you were getting labor for free would you suddenly want to pay for it? The south didn't want slavery to be abolished because they were still dependent on it while the north had begun to not need it at all.

if i recall correctly slaves were considered property, so they wouldn't be eligiable for any freedoms that everyone else enjoyed

? what changed ?

Hah... Tripper, before you start preaching about the US having it's faults. First learn a few things about US History.

First off, the Decleration of Independence simply stated the colonies devided off from the British and wished to form thier own government and country.

The Constitution is the "hypocritical document" that states the freedoms and rights of the people.

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[quote:5a602]So why did Americans accept slavery long after the British had abolished it?[/quote:5a602]

There are many reasons to this, and I explained a few on mIRC. If you'd like I could explain a few more.

[quote:5a602]for which your nation largely bases its independence on is a hypocritical document.
[/quote:5a602]

Geez, you're bent on the Constitution being "hyprocritical", aren't you??. I thought we settled this on mIRC, I guess not...

Slavery was a TOUCHY subject in the process of the creation and establishment of the Constitution. After the failure of the Articles of the Confederation, we were determined not to create other mistakes that would lead to the downfall of the US and possible colonization by another country...

Just to let you know, we DID abolish slavery in the early parts of the creation of the Constitution... then half the Southeren states left. After the Revolution, the colonies were in great turmoil and to have the Southern states leave would be a great fault in our "soon to be country". The main part of our economy at the time was in the South, if you get my drift. So the point was, we just didn't want to abolish slavery until we had a more fit and stronger government in play, before we had any huge descions on abolishing slavery, which later resulted in the Civil War.

I'm not trying to justify anything, but you wanted to know why we didn't abolish slavery, and I gave you a few reasons.

Our Constitution, believe it or not is looked upon as a Bible to most developing democratic societies... the amendment process is by far the most important aspect. It ensures that in time, THINGS WILL CHANGE. As so the topic of slavery, the amendment process quickly adapted to it.

Since you thought our freedoms and rights were based on the "Decleration of Independence", I still base my opinion on you not knowing what you are talking about, concerning the US. Learn a few more FACTS before you run in here stating certain governments are "hyprocritical".

And for you, Pyro. Stay out of the convo. If you're going to be a smartass.

When he died, I basically said fuck it!

He was basically the only person that I could trust and depend on.

Im dumb.

well you aren't from the US so you shouldn't have to know this, just do some research next time

Hmmm, because I got the names of two documents mixed up, I automatically know nothing about what I'm talking about? For a 17 kid from New Zealand, I consider myself pretty "learned," in this topic....You should be proud that people from other nations even bother to learn about your history. I'm willing to bet nobody on this forum knows anything about my country. Apart from maybe the aussies.

That fact remains, what I have said, I believe is still valid. One mistake doesn't mean my whole theory is messed up. FAR from it. Half of you even admitted that I was right on many occasions. Now you're just getting to emotional and taking everything personally. Brainwashed fools.

[quote="Cpt. Zapotoski":692d0]Tripper, you're cool and everything, but you're a god damn fool.

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First off, our country was founded on the Articles of Confederation, which didn't work out well and then we established the Decleration of Independence.
[/quote:692d0]
I'm not even going to mention what's wrong with that statement. You're out of control Zach... OUT OF CONTROL! Stay in school.

You know what...i think SPOOGE is OUT OF CONTROL! SERENITY NOW!

Actually, the brits had liberty and freedom 500 years before your damned countries even existed so eat kaka angel:


http://www.bl.uk/collections/treasures/magna.html

Heres a lil something called the Magna Carta

We also had the glorious revolution of 1688 to restore Parliamentary control, another 100 years before you..

And before this the Greeks and Romans had republics and freedom so actually the yanks arent the first to invent freedom and liberty.

But then I spose people can have different ideas on what freedom and liberty actually are..

hell yes! thats the America I love!

oh and think about this for a second. Remember David Koresh? He had hundreds beleiving that he was their god just by using simple techniques and scams. Now...not that I beleive this, but who is to say, that a couple thousand years ago , some guy didnt decide to write a book. He wrote about great warriors and saviors. When he was done with his book he read it aloud. people heard it and took it for the truth. eventually thus "truth" spread throughout nations. The book that this man wrote is now named "The Bible" and people say its the story of their creator. how does this , essentially, differ from the way Mr. Koresh, the sad sick sadistic psycho, brainwashed and fooled the people he led?

remember, humankind is known for its longing for hope and explanation. back in the day science wasnt the same as it is now. people would have been a lot easier to be convinced of a story like this. Especially if it gave any explanation of the biggest questions on the minds of the people.

Wow.

From free will / determinism to US history.

ROFL...

HAHA! yeah, that seems to happen alot around here.

im sorry for my ways i offer my mouth to thiose whoses shaft needs a clean - so drunk!