This thread is full of good little citizens.

I don't know of any major university in the nation that does not have it's own fully-fledged police department. The dept. at my univ. is every bit as legit as any other department. I know UF's department happens to be one that has been granted their own jurisdiction by the city of Gainesville. So Ranger, they're most certainly not rent a cops, so you should either know what you're talking about or stay out of the thread.

I have never known campus cops to be something to fuck with, just because you're on a campus you pay thousands to go to.

Well, I apologize then. I did see reports that the kid sucks in general AND was disruptive. BUT, tasering the kid at the john kerry conference? I just feel its taking it a LITTLE too far. Did you see how many cops (not security..) were there? They could have easily escorted him out. That shit is nuts...I mean, there was a video posted before of a student getting tasered in a library for no reason and the kids recorded the badge numbers of the security officers. I feel this shit happens far too often, and it should NOT happen...thats all. Oh and chronic, before you to tell me to gtfo, I go to a small liberal arts college in BURLINGTON VERMONT; even at Syracuse University where around thirty or so of my friends go, and the city I live in, I believe they have a campus security that doesn't have the ability to arrest...so give me a break here. All I am doing is saying there are other ways to resolve a situation like this besides making a fucking scene and tasering some kid EVEN if he deserves it; and Im getting bombarded from all angles ed:

well said ranger, i agree.

thank you <3

I agree too. Human beings have rights. While the guy was being a total douche by being disruptive and just plain annoying, he didnt deserve a tazering.

Look at how many cops are there. Even if one cop cant handle removing a non-violent suspect without use of this kind of extreme force, then they shouldnt be a fucking cop. When there is a group of them in the video it makes it even more ridiculous.

They should be able to do a job like that without a tazer or a gun. Plenty of cops do there jobs without even having these weapons in a bunch of places around the world and they get the job done fine. Removing one loud douche shouldnt be a problem.

Seriously, I dont understand how anyone can think these cops handled this situation properly. It was borderline police brutality, whether or not the suspect deserved it is irrelevant - cops are not fit to make these judgements, if he had committed a crime then they should have apprehended him formally. If not, then why does he need to be assaulted? They walked all over his human rights.

He wasn't complying with any of the officer's requests. He was resisting and flailing around all over the place.

I'm willing to bet the cops weren't going to do anything to him besides escort him outside and tell him to cut the shit - he hadn't broken any laws yet anyway.

Its one thing if a cop beats the shit out of a guy with a baton for no reason. But this little shit was trying to act all big and loud thinking his shit doesn't stink and absolutely refusing to cooperate.

The cops weren't fit to make what judgment? To taser him? ...last time i checked that was absolutely part of the officers right as a police officer. To determine the level of necessary force to detain someone, doing as minimal harm as possible to all parties involved. Its called discretion. How the hell were these officers supposed to apprehend him 'formally'? Send him a polite letter in the mail on some nice fancy paper?

Could this have been solved without the use of the taser? Its possible.
But the officer had every right to do what he did.

/\ Neah, he didn't.

[quote:4dbef]Some of you I don't get - at what point when someone is causing a public disturbance, do you say "Ok, it's time to go to Plan B"?
[/quote:4dbef]

I'd say right after you've even attempted plan A of physically removing the person. He was some nerd arguing with John Kerry, not a linebacker. They easily could have just grabbed him and manhandled him right out the door.

[quote="TGB!":8f485][quote:8f485]They could have easily escorted him out.[/quote:8f485]

You didn't see the part where they tried to do that, for nearly two minutes while he continued to make a spectacle and resist their efforts to remove him?I did, and I wondered why the fuck that many cops couldnt take a man down and remove him in a matter of seconds. The dude is a tiny nerd. This is their job. They get paid money and have training to deal with far more dangerous and deadly people. They shouldn't immediately move to excessive force. (and using a TASER in this situation IS excessive) Are we to assume these cops are totally useless without their Tasers? Even in a group of as many cops as there were? For fucks sake.
Totally unecessary.

I would put forth that giving him a lil juice is MUCH preferable to accidentally breaking his arm.
..But accidentally breaking his arm is only a possibility, just like him potentially having some kind of health condition that could lead the taser to accidentally kill him. The tasers aren't full-proof, and they most certainly aren't guaranteed non-fatal. People occasionally die from being assaulted with them. I know I'd rather MAYBE have my arm broken than MAYBE die.

Again, the shot COULDNT have been as powerful as his scream let us on to believe as he was up and joking (once the cameras were off) relatively quickly.
LOL. Okay.

[quote:8f485]Even if one cop cant handle removing a non-violent suspect without use of this kind of extreme force, then they shouldnt be a fucking cop.[/quote:8f485]

I think its about one cop not being able to handle the situation WITHOUT using physical force. Look at the big dicked n**** that comes up behind the kid. You don't think that guy COULDNT have ended this in a minute? Of course he could have. There were however cameras on these cops, and I'm sure they remember what happened in UCLA and this shitstorm that followed. This was going to be done as kid glove as possible. When he STILL refused to cooperate (at what point does someone resisting arrest become actionable to some of you), they give him an electro-kiss to get him to straighten out and OBEY COMMANDS.

Some of you I don't get - at what point when someone is causing a public disturbance, do you say "Ok, it's time to go to Plan B"?

I'm pretty sure you go to plan B when Plan A fails. Problem is, in a situation like this, Plan A SHOULDN'T fail. Like I said, if you cant remove a fucking college kid geek from a building without zapping him, and there are more than two of you, then you shouldn't be a police officer, because you're obviously not qualified for the job if you have to rely on your taser for a minor incident like this.

[/quote:8f485]

Have you ever been electrocuted? "electro-kiss?" Hardly.

In America alone, there have been over 150 deaths in which the use or abuse of the Taser by police and other law enforcement officials has been implicated.

Fact is, tasers are meant to be an alternative to guns because of the fact that they obviously are nowhere near as dangerous. Now would a gun be necessary in this situation? Of course not. So why use the taser?

What would they have done in this same situation before the taser was introduced? Its not the tiny little barely painful pinch you make it out to be.

thats exactly what cops ARE fit to do, make judgements about what force is necessary in a certain situation, thats what they train to do. sure, there are guidelines, but nothing in the field is black and white, its ultimately up to the officer to use his training to make a good decision. clearly they arent always right, but that statement is entirely false.

And just for shits and giggles:

[quote:2fa1b]Police report student told them: 'You didn't do anything wrong'
5:52 p.m., Sept. 18, 2007

Police have released the incident report detailing the Tasering of a University of Florida student during a campus forum with Sen. John Kerry Monday, and the officer who actually Tasered Andrew Meyer wrote in the report that Meyer later told police, "You didn't do anything wrong."

In the 12-page report, which gives accounts of the incident from the perspective of eight different officers who were present Monday afternoon, Officer Nicole Mallo writes that Meyer would only resist officers when cameras were present.

"As (Meyer) was escorted down stairs (at the University Auditorium) with no cameras in sight, he remained quiet, but once the cameras made their way down stairs he started screaming and yelling again," Mallo wrote.

Mallo was one of two officers who actually rode in the vehicle as Meyer was escorted to the Alachua County jail, and she said said he told them during the ride: "I am not mad at you guys, you didn't do anything wrong, you were just trying to do your job," according to Mallo's account.

Mallo also wrote in her report that he asked, at one point, if cameras would be present at the jail.

The report details the events leading up to Meyer's arrest, saying that Meyer was in line to ask a question of Sen. Kerry when it was decided that no more questions would be allowed.

Meyer continued down the aisle toward Sen. Kerry angrily, according to police, saying he wanted the senator to answer his question because he had been waiting for two hours.

Though Sen. Kerry directed that Meyer be allowed to ask his question, police reported that Meyer did not ask any specific question and instead "badgered" the senator, and at one point said something about President Clinton being impeached over a sexual act.

At that point, police reported that ACCENT Director Max Tyroler turned off Meyer's microphone and asked police to escort him out of the auditorium, saying, "He had said enough," according to Officer Mallo's report.

Officers then proceeded to attempt to remove Meyer from the room, but when he resisted, they placed him on the ground and tried to handcuff him. The six officers who actually took part in holding Meyer down while he was being handcuffed reported that they were only able to get a handcuff on his right hand because he was squirming so much.

The supervising officer, Sgt. Eddie King, attempted to Taser Meyer on his chest, but he reported that his Taser would not deploy. He then instructed Mallo to Taser Meyer, and she Tasered him on his shoulder, according to one of the officer's report.

The officers were then able to fully handcuff Meyer and escort him from the building. Each of the six officers reported that Meyer yelled things like, "They're going to kill me," and, "They are giving me to the government," while he was being taken from the room.

-- Alice Wallace/The Gainesville Sun [/quote:2fa1b]

http://www.starbanner.com/article/20070 ... AKING_NEWS

If the cops hadn't used a taser and had to use force to get this kid out, it would have probably caused him more harm than the taser did and they would have gotten into even more trouble.

Why should a cop have to sit there and fight a guy into submission anyway? I'm all for making it easier for them to do their jobs, especially with how little they get paid. I would have said, "fuck this man, I don't wanna get hit with a flailing leg while I try to wrestle this guy" and tasered him. THat is the safest and quickest way for the police to do what they needed to do.


The funniest part to me was that the guy thought they were going to take him away and kill him. "My friends now I'm here!" LOL

Okay, I read that part before posting it and I honestly didnt think there would be anyone stupid enough to read it the way you did, but I guess I was wrong and I should have made it clearer.

It is my OPINION (So therefore how could it be "FALSE," as you claim?) that the police (and no-one else) are NOT fit to judge whether or not a person DESERVES to be physically assaulted as some form of wild west punishment, which is what people in this thread are insinuating by making remarks such as "THE KID WAS BEING A LOUD DOUCHE THINKIN HIS SHIT DONT STINK HE DESERVED TO BE ZAPPED."

My point is that it isn't in their job description to hand out punishment, whether or not the kid was being a dick and deserved it - Their job is to apprehend suspects for the greater intention of upholding the law, a COURT OF LAW determines punishment.

You people are so stuck up in your beliefs that you think its a totally black and white issue. COPS WERE RIGHT DUDE WAS ANNOYING. It's not that simple, if it were, this wouldn't have been the media shitstorm it is - Would it?

SIX COPS - ONE SUSPECT. Seriously. This doesnt seem odd to you that they couldnt get cuffs on him?

Tasers are a relatively new piece of equipment in law enforcement - What do you think police would have done before? Not be able to apprehend the suspect? Or would they have just shot him?

Seriously, just humour me. What would they have done? What are they doing whenever they have to take suspects 'down-town?'

Are they just zapping everyone now the minute they show any kind of resistance? Thats kind of fucked up.
Im very glad our government decided not to put tasers into police hands, because this is exactly what they assumed would happen. Cops would get way too comfortable using them, and would just zap people when they dont need to, just because the suspect wouldn't die afterwards.

[quote:e6d11]Whatever. You're ignoring events in the video, and eyewitness accounts that happened during AND after to make your point, as well as giving these cops leeway and mysterious RoboCop powers in their ability to FLAWLESSLY control the situation.[/quote:e6d11]

So 6 cops need mysterious robocop powers to take down ONE suspect without their tasers? What are you saying...?

[quote:e6d11]You refer to some Amnesty Intl. report (if its the same one that is bandied about), that is sloppy in its reporting. 150 deaths over how many years versus how many people who hadn't died when the TASER was used in the process of restraining them. Also nevermind that there is no IMPLICIT link between the taser being the cause of death just that "well these folks who died also had been shot". Only in SEVEN of these 150 cases, did a medical official actually list the taser as being the cause of death.[/quote:e6d11]

Debateable.

[quote:e6d11]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electroshock_weapon_controversy[/quote:e6d11]

What this all comes down to is the Taser. Its pretty obvious police are quick to use it. In my opinion this is a bad thing, because you cant deny there is deadly risk involved with using it.

[quote:e6d11]He wasn't electrocuted. He was tasered. I'm sure you know the difference. [/quote:e6d11]

Come on, don't be pathetic. Its known as an ELECTROSHOCK WEAPON.

What, are you gonna try and argue that it doesn't use an electric shock to stun the victim?

Anything to one-up someone, right TGB?

But there is a point where their job of apprehension can require force, hell, no one wants to go to jail, that's why the cops have to use force. Tasers are not a form of punishment, and neither are guns, they are just necessary tools for policemen to do their jobs.

maybe you arent very clear on the english language, but "deserve" does not necessarily imply a moral judgement.

i never mentioned "punishment", what they did was not punishment, it was a tool to allow them to get the guy to stop squirming so they could cuff him.

oOo: hmmm

The kid must be beating off right now to his 4 pages of posts.

[img]http://homepage.ntlworld.com/gerald.marley/me-came.jpg[/img]

i think its bullshit. he asked legitimate questions, and they need to be answered, whether its on the news or in a small lecture hall. im so sick of people being like "well it wasnt appropriate" or "he was being rude" or something. he wants change, and he's doing what he feels necessary. i respect him for that. i personally dont think this shithole of a country wont change unless people start dying on a massive scale. its a shame its gotten to that point.

Not really a shame... Just another good whack at Eutopia.

he clearly was out to make a scene and get camera time, by making the scene he did is exactly what he wanted... if kerry would have answered his questions and that was it, then we wouldnt be talking about it. its a democracy, if you want change, get involved in supporting a candidate and get the word out, get people voting.

I woulda kicked him square in teh balls

Im talking about and to the people that are backing the police just because of how the guy looked on the video, just because he seemed like an annoying person. Im not saying these cops were trying to outright lay out punishment on this guy. Im insinuating that they didnt handle the situation as best they could, as bold as that is for a non-cop to say - I just think those tasers arent as peaceful as people like TGB attempt to make them seem.

TGB - Seven deaths which are directly linked to the taser's bite is nothing to be proud of. Especially when you consider that a huge chunk of the 150 people (which is actually something like 240 people) that died, passed on due to health conditions that the taser exacerbated. This means that while the taser didnt directly cause the death, it played a secondary role, which in my opinion is enough justification to label it a potentially fatal weapon that shouldnt replace old school physical police work - At LEAST until further conclusions can be made on its safety.

That's what makes it fucking debateable. Tosser.

Im not saying they are. calmdown:

Who said anything about satisfying male egos? You're putting words in my mouth here....Is that so your point sounds more dramatic? Cool, man.

I just think that the taser in its current form shouldn't replace simple physical police procedure.

Hmmm, let me think about this. I thought being electrocuted was the fucking DEFINITION of being given a jolt of electricity............Wait.....a........sec...... .So, to you, these are two different things?

HEY EVERYBODY - APPARENTLY, IF YOU THINK ELECTRICITY IS USED TO ELECTROCUTE, THEN YOU HAVE ZERO SCALE - TIME TO GO MARCH ON WASHINGTON!

TGB FOR PRESIDENT! LETS CLEAN THIS PLACE UP.

So you still believe that the officers should have continued wrestling the kid until he submitted? Why should the officers risk getting injured and risk injuring the kid AND allow the disturbance to go on longer? Imagine if they hadn't tased him and he kept resisting and ended up breaking a cops nose with a flailing fist. Then he could be charged with assault on a police officer and that would be way worse than what he was charged with. The point is that none of those involved could know what was gonna happen. The taser provided a quick, safe end to the situation, and gave the officers control--that is what it is designed to do.

That's how I see it.


BTW, electrocution is technically death by electricity but I think nits are being picked in this thread.

Meh. The kid got what he deserved. The only thing the police did wrong was that they didn't beat the crap outa him with Billy clubs. I'm in favor of the zero tolerance rule. If you don't do what the officer tells you, he has every right to beat you until you comply.

you are a fucking nuter tgb; I hope you know this.

i for one am all for tazers, they were great to collect n' swap, I dont know what the fuck this
anti Kerry guy is on about quite frankly....or am i getting mixed up with Tazos..?, anyway..yeah..

He's not a nutter so much as he just doesn't allow people to have their own opinions. He just cant make his points without being an obnoxious, rude, and know-it-all buttnugget.




Seriously, anybody that was watching that video and was seriously thinking "OH YEAH FUCK YEAH GET THAT FUCKING GUY," is a fucking sociopath.
Tasers are fucking dangerous. TGB can deny it all he wants because apparently people like amnesty international are the enemy to him, and you cant trust them.
FAX ME THROUGH THE REPORT BY MONDAY, ya fuckin douche.

[quote:544c8]Go smoke the peace pipe and w/e other hip aware thing the kids do these days. [/quote:544c8]

LOVED this part. Keep it up, friendless.

Yeah..calling him a nut isn't exactly right; what you said sums it up. Keep on smoking that peace pipe...lol.

Being zapped with a taser is being electrocuted. I'm not comment on anything else, but a zap from a taser is definitely getting electrocuted.

[quote="TK-423":b78dc]Being zapped with a taser is being electrocuted. I'm not comment on anything else, but a zap from a taser is definitely getting electrocuted.[/quote:b78dc]

I didn't know this but apparently the word itself technically means a fatal electric shock, despite the fact that most people nowadays would say they had been 'electrocuted' by an electric fence, or a power socket.

[quote="TK-423":17f76]Being zapped with a taser is being electrocuted. I'm not comment on anything else, but a zap from a taser is definitely getting electrocuted.[/quote:17f76]

incorrect.

[quote=c312]incorrect.[/quote:f315b]

Gtfo...you have to be kidding right? Inform me what it is then; Im all ears.

[quote=RaNgeR]Gtfo...you have to be kidding right? Inform me what it is then; Im all ears.[/quote:0d43d]

\/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/


[quote=Tripper]I didn't know this but apparently the word itself technically means a fatal electric shock, despite the fact that most people nowadays would say they had been 'electrocuted' by an electric fence, or a power socket.[/quote:0d43d]



...He's right....

Pathetic to even argue something so ridiculously irrelevant though.

[quote=RaNgeR]Gtfo...you have to be kidding right? Inform me what it is then; Im all ears.[/quote:00fb3]

[url=http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/electrocution:00fb3]Left ear.[/url:00fb3]

[url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrocution:00fb3]Right ear.[/url:00fb3]

rolleyes:

The only reason its "irrelevant" - is because it sensationalizes your point. "Oh look the cops are electrocuting people". This is what they call intellectual dishonesty.