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-   Politics, Current Events & History (alliedassault.us/forumdisplay.php?f=35)
-   -   US Soldier court martialed and sentanced to death (alliedassault.us/showthread.php?t=46019)

Machette 04-30-2005 08:50 PM
I'm gonna go with everyone on this one, Whatada...shut the fuck up

TiberiusAD 05-01-2005 09:00 AM
Short,

Yeah, you totally missed what I was saying there. Let me re-cap:

Judas said: "im imagining that those killed probably gave him a pretty hard time about his beliefs."

I have never...never seen one soldier insult another based on a religious preference. It is both a hightened sence of respect for each other, and a respect for personal freedom.

So I said: "Real soldiers do not show that kind of disrespect."

This is all in relation to our subject, the Sgt who took other soldiers lives so he would not have to go into battle.

Your pic, is a entirly different situation. In fact, my opinion on that matter is simply: SOMEONE told them to do this. There was an order SOMEWHERE that was given to the guards at the prison.
I think it was a humiliation tactic by CIA/Interigation officers to attempt to force the captives to talk. Humiliation is a HUGE pressure point in their culture.
I seriously doubt that the soldiers took it upon themselves to arrange such elaborate pictures, and abuses.

Tripper 05-01-2005 03:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Madmartagen
Whatada, just shut the fuck up, ok you retard? Re-read what you posted with your head out of your ass and then tell me how that nugget of knowledge you had isnt the most ignorant bullshit ever.

Short, what is the purpose of posting that pic? These are two seperate incidents, and although you seem to feel that you made some sort of point by posting that pic while highlighting Robs specific quote, the subject at hand and the Abu Gahraib scandal are completely unrelated. He said 'real soldiers dont show that kind of disrespect.' As in, we already know that those prison guards are pieces of shit and thus arent considered real soldiers. Where is the correlation?

This guy deserves the firing squad/noose because hes a traitor, plain and simple. During war, there is a more severe dependancy for you to stick to your duty and proffesionalism when you are on the battlefield. If he wasnt able to keep himself out of it, then he has to suck it up or do his time in jail. You are supposed to count on your friends and brothers in war above everyone else, especially when you feel like you are in an unjust war. You think those other soldiers wanted to be there? Anyone here think they would rather sit in the sand than to be home? He could have refused to go out on patrol and take the consequences like a man. Instead, he opted out like a coward and killed his brothers who were in the same situation as he was.
Summed up right there ladies and gentlemen. I totally agree.

Short Hand 05-01-2005 04:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TiberiusAD
Short,

Yeah, you totally missed what I was saying there. Let me re-cap:

Judas said: "im imagining that those killed probably gave him a pretty hard time about his beliefs."

I have never...never seen one soldier insult another based on a religious preference. It is both a hightened sence of respect for each other, and a respect for personal freedom.

So I said: "Real soldiers do not show that kind of disrespect."

This is all in relation to our subject, the Sgt who took other soldiers lives so he would not have to go into battle.

Your pic, is a entirly different situation. In fact, my opinion on that matter is simply: SOMEONE told them to do this. There was an order SOMEWHERE that was given to the guards at the prison.
I think it was a humiliation tactic by CIA/Interigation officers to attempt to force the captives to talk. Humiliation is a HUGE pressure point in their culture.
I seriously doubt that the soldiers took it upon themselves to arrange such elaborate pictures, and abuses.
I am not trying to justify his actions zen, only show you that soldiers aren't these perfect machines. We have no clue what went on with this guy, and to tell you the truth, in order for him to do what he did..... something very FUCKED up must have been happenning, All I know is, I would tell my commander to shove it if he told me to do such things.

TiberiusAD 05-01-2005 06:14 PM
[quote="Short Hand":04681]...only show you that soldiers aren't these perfect machines....[/quote:04681]

I never meant to insinuate any such notion, only to point out that I personally, as a soldier have never witnessed any kind of disrespect stemming from religion.

Tripper 05-01-2005 10:10 PM
[quote="Short Hand":1ee1a]
Quote:
Originally Posted by TiberiusAD
Short,

Yeah, you totally missed what I was saying there. Let me re-cap:

Judas said: "im imagining that those killed probably gave him a pretty hard time about his beliefs."

I have never...never seen one soldier insult another based on a religious preference. It is both a hightened sence of respect for each other, and a respect for personal freedom.

So I said: "Real soldiers do not show that kind of disrespect."

This is all in relation to our subject, the Sgt who took other soldiers lives so he would not have to go into battle.

Your pic, is a entirly different situation. In fact, my opinion on that matter is simply: SOMEONE told them to do this. There was an order SOMEWHERE that was given to the guards at the prison.
I think it was a humiliation tactic by CIA/Interigation officers to attempt to force the captives to talk. Humiliation is a HUGE pressure point in their culture.
I seriously doubt that the soldiers took it upon themselves to arrange such elaborate pictures, and abuses.
I am not trying to justify his actions zen, only show you that soldiers aren't these perfect machines. We have no clue what went on with this guy, and to tell you the truth, in order for him to do what he did..... something very FUCKED up must have been happenning, All I know is, I would tell my commander to shove it if he told me to do such things.[/quote:1ee1a]

Nah, you just didn't think before you posted that totally irrelevant pic - Just trying to stir up controversy as usual, too bad everyone here already knows the drill so all you stir up is more dislike for your behaviour and yourself in general.
Zen never even elluded to the fact that soldiers were perfect machines. You pulled that out of your ass as an excuse for your ignorant mistake. To me, this character seems like a fanatic, just a typical islamic extremist. They're all over places like Palestine and Iraq, so whats so hard about believeing one would be in the U.S? He said himself he wouldn't stop until the U.S was destroyed or something along those lines....That should sum it up right there.

Fact is, this guy is obviously not a typical soldier, and typical soldiers obviously wouldn't act like that. Otherwise, you would see it way more often within the armed services....You don't have to be a psychology major to see the clear signs.

Short Hand 05-02-2005 05:48 AM
Nope. I was trying to state a point. I wouldn't try and start stupid shit with zen since I actaully have respect for him. "The Whole Soldier Thing" is a way for me to illustrate in some way or another the faults which would have eventaully contributed to this event. my nick name is Short Hand, not Pyro kiwi. Keep your lectures in your pants. kekeke rolleyes:

Tripper 05-02-2005 06:16 AM
[quote="Short Hand":7fc86]Nope. I was trying to state a point. I wouldn't try and start stupid shit with zen since I actaully have respect for him. "The Whole Soldier Thing" is a way for me to illustrate in some way or another the faults which would have eventaully contributed to this event. my nick name is Short Hand, not Pyro kiwi. Keep your lectures in your pants. kekeke rolleyes:[/quote:7fc86]

What point were you trying to state? It's just childish immaturity.

I don't believe you - I think you're full of shit. You didn't even attempt a rebuttle to the second half of my post, either....

Short Hand 05-02-2005 07:14 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tripper
To me, this character seems like a fanatic, just a typical islamic extremist. They're all over places like Palestine and Iraq, so whats so hard about believeing one would be in the U.S? He said himself he wouldn't stop until the U.S was destroyed or something along those lines....That should sum it up right there.
I do not think an al mighty Islamic extremist would take any such part in the US military. NOt to mention show remorse such as this.

[quote:6ffb4]"I want to apologize for the attack that occurred. I felt that my life was in jeopardy, and I had no other options. I also want to ask you for forgiveness," Akbar told the jury before it deliberated in the sentencing phase.[/quote:6ffb4]

Also note he felt his fellow muslims were in danger (Kind of a weird thought to have if you in the military in the first place..)

[quote:6ffb4]Prosecutors say Akbar launched the attack at his camp -- days before the soldiers were to move into Iraq -- because he was concerned about U.S. troops killing fellow Muslims in the Iraq war.[/quote:6ffb4]

Which in turn prooves his mental capacity, maybe not insane, but he was suffering from it. His paranoid state in a way drove him to these attacks, which were in vain and on the wrong targets from that start. ( I am not justifying his actions, only trying to explain them).

[quote:6ffb4]A defense psychiatrist testified that although Akbar was legally sane and understood the consequences of his attack, he suffered from forms of paranoia and schizophrenia.[/quote:6ffb4]

&

[quote:6ffb4]A defense psychiatrist testified that although Akbar was legally sane and understood the consequences of his attack, he suffered from forms of paranoia and schizophrenia.[/quote:6ffb4]

Now note that if he is indeed suffering from these 2 disability's, then the harrassment he was enduring only made it worse, and painted a target on the people which were doing it. So in a way you can see this taunting turning him to beleive his fellow soldiers were the threat. The truth is they were not.... BUT in his really messed up head, they seemed to be the most direct threat. Do you understand ? Is that enough to explain it all out...

ed:

Sgt>Stackem 05-02-2005 08:23 AM
Short, when you were a baby did they drop you on your head?

Short Hand 05-02-2005 08:48 AM
It is an easy connection to make. Ill put in a more simple form.

Paranoid + schizo + harrassment + fundamentalist(not militant) + possibility of having to kill a fellow muslim = Dead GI's.

Johnj 05-02-2005 08:49 AM
Image that, the people who were actually involved with the case came to a different conclusion than Short did. I don't know, maybe they had facts to work with.

eek:

Short Hand 05-02-2005 08:52 AM
Remember the movie Paths Of Glory ?

Poseidon 05-02-2005 12:13 PM
I do agree he should be killed, but I also think that other information would be withheld from the public. We don't know the exact circumstances and details as most wouldn't be released. He COULD have been suffering from racism, as racism is all around, many of these racist people could EASILY join a military force.

Yes if racism was the case he could have taken it to his CO etc and i'm 100% certain that the issue would have been resolved. But he COULD have been an extremist. We don't have the exact details and will probably never have them!

His actions WERE wrong as would have killed more than just the involved people (if racism was the reason) and I agree death is the answer but we just dont know the details.

Tripper 05-02-2005 02:56 PM
Harrassment? Where does it say he was harrassed? Why did you add that to the equation....?


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