if allowing americans the right to bear arms is trusting the people...well they are pretty much fucking it up with their murder rates.

Meh...I guess people don't care that for them to have a gun...thousands have to die by the same invention.

Sorry - this one is old (1998), but relates to stats taken from The Third International Crime Victimization Survey (ICVS)....Pertinent points to note:
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* The highest incidence of violent crime in the industrialized world was in England and Wales.
* Canadians suffer as much violent crime as Americans, and more non-violent crime.
* Crimes of all sorts, including murder, are lowest in those states with the highest rates of gun ownership.
* The murder rates in other industrialized nations have inched closer to those in the U.S. despite various attempts to register all guns or license all gun owners, or even ban guns altogether.
* Burglaries in Canada are more than four times as likely to occur when the residents are home as they are in the U.S.
* States such as Vermont, New Hampshire, North Dakota and Montana, where gun ownership is at least twice what it is in Canada, have murder rates as low as one-half that in the Canadian provinces which are their immediate neighbours.
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I think you can make stats say about anything you want but to me it is interesting that when you compare areas of these USA that have similar population densities to Canada, we have much lower crime stats. I also found one article that said that Canada and the UK report their murder rates differently than the US. In those countries it is reported only after a conviction. For some reason in the US it is reported as a murder - even if during the trial it is found to be an accidental shooting or manslaughter.

I also found the following, which leads me to think that there are scores of Canadians who do believe the current registration law is oppressive...

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It has been estimated that as many as 900,000 gun-owning Canadians have not registered their firearms. As of June 2003, 6.4 million firearms had been registered which is far short of the government's 1974 estimate of 10 million guns in Canada. Currently, all provinces and territories save Quebec (which has the lowest gun ownership rate) oppose the registry and refuse to prosecute violators.



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gotta go more later. .... Dang I didn't mean to get roped into another long running debate! LOL

Well im more so refering to Toronto...which has crime, but seemingly less than cities of our size in America...I can't really speak for much else than Brampton or Toronto.

Brampton is FUCKED though.

the gun related deaths:population ratio in canada is higher than in the US. However the raw number is much smaller. Things micheal moore hid from us....

Even so...if our population was the same as USA...it doens't guarentee that would make us have more crime than the US.

[quote="Eight Ace":ca44a]
rise up and kick the shit out of all those gun toting armed to the teeth trigger happy ..erm nvm.. loney:[/quote:ca44a]


I dare ya! hellfire:

lets sample.

I beleive the movie said 175 canadian deaths. related to fire arms.


compared to 12k + american deaths related to fire arms.



NOw our population is 35million.

Yours is 253million.


in comparision if my numbers are correct from my web sources, your murder rate is still 10 times higher then ours per capita. If our population were the same as yours, we would have around 1250 to 1300 gun related murders. I see no way in which you made this conclusion.

[quote:f759a]156 were killed with firearms in homicides; 45 died in "accidents"; for an overall death rate of 3.5 per 100,000.(Kwing Hung. “Firearm Statistics (Jurisdictional Tables).” Department of Justice. March 2000.)[/quote:f759a]

Even so I added an extra 19 deaths onto my calculations. So the numbers are even lower. I fail to see how you see this. That was a comment pulled straight out of your ass for your hatred of Mr Moore.