Heh, thanks guys. I await his "accept Jesus or go to hell" rhetoric.

Any Jews here?

Assuming i was wrong, and when i died it turns out there was a god and so i got sent to hell, it wouldnt be so bad. I'd be able to see all my friends because they would end up there too, and there would be some pretty cool people to meet. Id be quite happy to punch hitler the face. I may even suck up to the devil enough and become one of his demonic minions.

I would personally be driven insane if i was sent to heaven. Imagine...enternity with people like those preacher guys, and the royal family, and many other stuck up snobs.

Yes, if you honestly repented for it, yes.

How is that not one sided?

so this is like that preschol bullshit where a kid hit another in the face with a rock and then they tell the teacher they're sorry and are free to go, that's fucking bullshit!

Anyone who claims that a religious criminal is better than an honest agnostic is FULL OF SHIT!

why is it that we as humans pretend that we are ultimate beings? we are nothing but organic matter made from the stars, and when we die our body is recycled. we are only put on this earth because the necessary elements for life were created and evolved into human beings. the mind is destroyed during death, and that mind will never live again, therefore ending that life. since the universe is slowly dying and will never be re-created, you will never ever live again. don't even try to convince yourself that you will somehow live again. I do however believe in the preachings of the bible as a way to live, and try to follow them as best as I can.

[quote="Sgt Stryker":685f9]
so this is like that preschol where a kid hit another in the face with a rock and then they tell the teacher they're sorry and are free to go, that's ing !

Anyone who claims that a religious criminal is better than an honest agnostic is FULL OF ![/quote:685f9]

Sorry you see it that way.

This is why I try to avoid the Offtopic forum, it just ends up with people arguing there very different beleifs, each claiming the other is stupid.

[quote=Fallout]Sorry you see it that way.

This is why I try to avoid the Offtopic forum, it just ends up with people arguing there very different beleifs, each claiming the other is stupid.[/quote:39887]
Shutup! You are stupid! The offtopic forum isnt anything like that at all! oOo:

i was kidding by the way, i read my post and it didnt seem like i was

Maybe some people should spend less time reading their bible and more time reading a dictionary. That would make the world a better place.

[quote:91fdf]so this is like that preschol bullshit where a kid hit another in the face with a rock and then they tell the teacher they're sorry and are free to go, that's fucking bullshit!

Anyone who claims that a religious criminal is better than an honest agnostic is FULL OF SHIT! [/quote:91fdf]

A "religious" criminal is no better than any other criminal. Now people whoe are killed, and put in jail for teaching Jesus are not criminals, but people being punished for spreading the truth. Im no better than any criminal injail right now. You know, if you do sin, and you truly repent and turn away you will be saved and forgiven, God will forget the sin ever happen, you will still suffer the consequences of your actions, but you will go to Heaven. God is loving, we all mess up, if we couldnt mess up at all we would all die and go to hell, but no God loved us enough to send His only Son to die for us.


[quote:91fdf]fun to read Innoxx own him though
Unknown_Sniper or repetative. Duke keeps saying the same things over and over and over and over again. Innoxx keeps owning him freestyle ten ways to sunday
[/quote:91fdf]

Im getting owned? No I got owned to do, but that was at a Pc game online, at this I am not getting owned, but you are deciving yourselfs, the truth is near just accept it!

[quote:91fdf]Assuming i was wrong, and when i died it turns out there was a god and so i got sent to hell, it wouldnt be so bad. I'd be able to see all my friends because they would end up there too, and there would be some pretty cool people to meet. Id be quite happy to punch hitler the face. I may even suck up to the devil enough and become one of his demonic minions.

I would personally be driven insane if i was sent to heaven. Imagine...enternity with people like those preacher guys, and the royal family, and many other stuck up snobs. [/quote:91fdf]

Uh, in hell you would see nobody, you would be in total darkness and feel nashing of teeth, and the undying fire. As for Heaven, its not made of snobs, no but loving people who knew God.




[quote:91fdf]why is it that we as humans pretend that we are ultimate beings? we are nothing but organic matter made from the stars, and when we die our body is recycled. we are only put on this earth because the necessary elements for life were created and evolved into human beings. the mind is destroyed during death, and that mind will never live again, therefore ending that life. since the universe is slowly dying and will never be re-created, you will never ever live again. don't even try to convince yourself that you will somehow live again. I do however believe in the preachings of the bible as a way to live, and try to follow them as best as I can. [/quote:91fdf]

Well, we will live again, and I wish you would live by the command to accept Jesus, for your sake.



[quote:91fdf]Maybe some people should spend less time reading their bible and more time reading a dictionary. That would make the world a better place. [/quote:91fdf]

We need more people read and LIVING by the Bible, that is what this sinful world needs!

I believe one of teh Star Wars characters said: you assume too much,

I'm pretty sure they were talking about you

In response to an earlier post referring to "Why God hasn't come down to
show himself", I will play the Devil's advocate and say this: assuming God
or whatever supraphysical entity exists, we can assume freedom of choice
is intact... UNLESS the being reveals himself. It would be a direct violation
of that freedom of choice: then, the only possibility in this case would be
that you have total liberty to choose atheism, agnosticism or theism. Also,
question the logic behind the "Heaven and Hell" concept. I will proceed to
explain my position and belief: feel free to think about the material I am
about to post and question it when it sinks in. I came across this material
and agree with it... I will post a link to the material in its verbatim form.

[url:b6e2a]http://www.geocities.com/solidusownsj00/freedom.htm[/url:b6e2a]

PS. I know absolutely NO ONE will bother reading it, however I felt compelled
to post it...

Duke,

Can you force anyone to love you?

Can you demand being loved?

Would you really love someone if there are “conditions”
attached?

What happens to true Love in these situations?

The moment we try to force anyone to love us, or impose any
conditions, the Higher feeling that we call Love – simply stops
existing. It is instantly replaced by feelings of bitterness,
disappointment and even deceit, as soon as any conditions are
discovered.

This is a very “delicate situation” – to say the least.
From the above, it is clear that:

In order to experience True Love - the autonomy of
individual intellects cannot be in any way compromised.
Individual intellects have to CHOOSE themselves to give their
Highest feelings to other individual intellects by their OWN
Free Will.

Hence, we can define the autonomy of the “individual
intellects” as a necessary condition in “Designing for Love”.

FREEDOM OF CHOICE.

Heaven and Hell cannot be what await you at the moment of physical
death, assuming supraphysical states of consciousness and existence
really ARE.

Check your premises...

I'm not sure how you reached that conclusion. Are you saying that God forces us to love him?

The exact opposite, my dear. Choice...

Unlike Duke's God, mine is a supraintelligent being that designed the
Universe with beauty and love in mind: he gave you Life and the freedom
to acknowledge his existence and the choice to Love his being.

Life isn't a biased test in which the final outcome is either Heaven or Hell:
that is my contention and I will stand by it. Of all "beliefs", it is the most
logical and consistent of all. I suggest taking a look at the link I posted...

my god 20 pages.......

If Duke's God is that same as mine, this is a description of him

No.

Unlikely, if he is willing to allow one of his prized creations to suffer eternity
in the worst imaginable place after one physical incarnation: considering how
your tabula rasa is filled by an education and values partly instilled in you
by your parents and the society of your time and place, if your freedom of
choice lands you in Hell, he is not at all the same being I choose to believe
in.

Very illogical thing for a supreme intellect to do if you ask me. Wouldn't you
agree ?

How would we know? To a dog, the act of washing dishes must be incomprehensable (sp?). If we are but children, who are we to know what Gods intentions are? Someone mentioned years of sufferring. To an enternal being, what are a few millenia?

How can our simple minds hope to understand the forces behind the creation of the universe? We dont even fully understand our own bodies. So that brings us to faith. You accept it, you reject it, you make a decision, but it is anything but simple.

[quote:9ffa0]The exact opposite, my dear. Choice...

Unlike Duke's God, mine is a supraintelligent being that designed the
Universe with beauty and love in mind: he gave you Life and the freedom
to acknowledge his existence and the choice to Love his being.

Life isn't a biased test in which the final outcome is either Heaven or Hell:
that is my contention and I will stand by it. Of all "beliefs", it is the most
logical and consistent of all. I suggest taking a look at the link I posted...
[/quote:9ffa0]


Well that is not unlike my God, infact thats a great description of Him, but if you choose to deny Him then you must suffer. YOu might say, "well God wouldnt do that, not if he is loving", sorry but He will. God made it so easy for us, all we have to do is believe, so yes I can understand GOd being mad at us for not accepting, I mean Jesus died for us, sufferd for us, God allowed us to live, he gave us many chances, and again made it simple its not even funny. Now being a Christian may not be easy, but becoming one is, I know it may be hard to ask for help, you may be embarresed, but why let that stop you from eternal peace? Yea lets compare the religions and see which one makes the most sense.



[quote:9ffa0]Duke,

Can you force anyone to love you?

Can you demand being loved?

Would you really love someone if there are “conditions”
attached?

What happens to true Love in these situations?

The moment we try to force anyone to love us, or impose any
conditions, the Higher feeling that we call Love – simply stops
existing. It is instantly replaced by feelings of bitterness,
disappointment and even deceit, as soon as any conditions are
discovered.

This is a very “delicate situation” – to say the least.
From the above, it is clear that:

In order to experience True Love - the autonomy of
individual intellects cannot be in any way compromised.
Individual intellects have to CHOOSE themselves to give their
Highest feelings to other individual intellects by their OWN
Free Will.

Hence, we can define the autonomy of the “individual
intellects” as a necessary condition in “Designing for Love”.

FREEDOM OF CHOICE.

Heaven and Hell cannot be what await you at the moment of physical
death, assuming supraphysical states of consciousness and existence
really ARE.

Check your premises... [/quote:9ffa0]

Im not trying to get you to love me, thats the least of my worries, my only concern is for you all that have not accepted the Truth, I do not want anybody to go to hell, nor does God, but He will do what he has to do. Yes God gave us freedom of choice, but there is a right and a wrong.



[quote:9ffa0]No.

Unlikely, if he is willing to allow one of his prized creations to suffer eternity
in the worst imaginable place after one physical incarnation: considering how
your tabula rasa is filled by an education and values partly instilled in you
by your parents and the society of your time and place, if your freedom of
choice lands you in Hell, he is not at all the same being I choose to believe
in.

Very illogical thing for a supreme intellect to do if you ask me. Wouldn't you
agree ? [/quote:9ffa0]

God gave us the choice to accept him or deny him, and God will send you to hell, do not try to kid yoursellf otherwise.

How do you know God will send someone to hell. I am not even sure God will send Adolf Hitler to hell. Because you can not always help yourself.

Why do I think this? An example: We all say 'Hitler was crazy'. Because he was. Out of his mind. What was he thinking? He probably thought he was doing the right thing? Crazy? Yes.

True crazy people don't know they're crazy, so why judge them for what they do, or are? People are not always in control of the things you do.

Think about it.

I'll see it when I get there. Best thing to do until then? Try to live a good life. For yourself as well as others. Goes for believers as well as non-believers.

As for atheists, agnostics...can they help themselves? You are what you are. How you growed up has influence. So does your environment. Consider this: You are an Indian, born in 1300 A.D. You don't believe in God, but worship the Sun. Or some other thing. You live a good life. God exists. Will you go to hell? Because you are 'ignorant'?

Think about it.

[quote:825b5]
How can our simple minds hope to understand the forces behind the creation of the universe? We dont even fully understand our own bodies. So that brings us to faith. You accept it, you reject it, you make a decision, but it is anything but simple. [/quote:825b5]

Ya know, I actually agree with you, we cant compeltely understand God always, sometimes you can someimes you cant, and it is through Faith that you believe.




[quote:825b5]How do you know God will send someone to hell. I am not even sure God will send Adolf Hitler to hell. Because you can not always help yourself.

Why do I think this? An example: We all say 'Hitler was crazy'. Because he was. Out of his mind. What was he thinking? He probably thought he was doing the right thing? Crazy? Yes.

True crazy people don't know they're crazy, so why judge them for what they do, or are? People are not always in control of the things you do.

Think about it.

I'll see it when I get there. Best thing to do until then? Try to live a good life. For yourself as well as others. Goes for believers as well as non-believers.

As for atheists, agnostics...can they help themselves? You are what you are. How you growed up has influence. So does your environment. Consider this: You are an Indian, born in 1300 A.D. You don't believe in God, but worship the Sun. Or some other thing. You live a good life. God exists. Will you go to hell? Because you are 'ignorant'?

[/quote:825b5]

Well I am sure God sends people to hell,as for Hitler, well I have an idea where he is, but if he truly repented then he is in Heaven. There is no point is just leading a good life, that will get you no where, again you must accept Jesus. As for the Indian, I believe that God gives them a chance to repent and accept Christ.

Your telling me that no matter what....if Hitler honestly repented and felt sorry. HE got into heaven? see if I was god Id say "hitler we need to talk...You were a mean son of a bitch....you dont deserve hell...you get to be a everything you hate forever, a jewish, homosexual, half black half asain, baldheaded, weak little man." See how long he can last. I mean really. Getting stabbed so manytimes with pitchforks sounds bad and all but you will get used to it after a while,

[quote:fef96]As for the Indian, I believe that God gives them a chance to repent and accept Christ.[/quote:fef96]

LMFAO


[quote:fef96]How would we know? To a dog, the act of washing dishes must be incomprehensable (sp?). If we are but children, who are we to know what Gods intentions are? Someone mentioned years of sufferring. To an enternal being, what are a few millenia?

How can our simple minds hope to understand the forces behind the creation of the universe? We dont even fully understand our own bodies. So that brings us to faith. You accept it, you reject it, you make a decision, but it is anything but simple. [/quote:fef96]

What will a dog go see first ? The piece of shit on the floor or the diamond?
He will go play with the fecal matter. Why ? His mind can't see the beauty of
the diamond and admire the design of the Universe. God's intentions are
most likely the same as any advanced intellect: the need to feel love, to be
loved, give it and other higher feelings: he doesn't play dice. Is this not the
best outcome ? In any case, when you are at a point where you do not need
to physically incarnate inside a body to experience certain spiritual things, u
might be in a better position to know what it is that the creational entity wants
but until then, we're all just assuming a bunch of things. I will take the logical
one over Christianity any day.

I'd rather live in a world full of law-abiding atheists than a world full of God-fearing killers.

"But you must accept Jaysus and in that accept in Gaahd. He, the Lawd o'mightay, will be youur savior and they will offuh sanctuary to those who have sinned but willfuly repent in the naaaaaame of Jaysus.
"If you do nat accept Jaysus and deny the will of Gaahd then you will surely be condemned to et-er-ni-ty in the faaaary pits o Heyll!"

[/cheap American accent]

Keep going, Duke. Another 21 pages of your preaching and we'll all be saved.

I just have to ask you Duke. YOu keep saying we are no longer on your hands. SO why the hell do you care anymore? let us go to hell if thats how it is. IF you continue to try to press god into our minds and "Souls" you will continue to have our blood on your hands as you say. So therefore you have failed ot teach us. and it is your fault. So to avoid this just dont try to do anything for us

holy crack 2000 views!!!this topic is making me rich!

no you were put out of the pictuer on the first couple of pages. ITs been DUke, me, SLoi, most of the way. so its made US famous....

[quote:72750]Uh, in hell you would see nobody, you would be in total darkness and feel nashing of teeth, and the undying fire[/quote:72750]

Some would call that foreplay.

[quote="Unknown_Sniper":66670]I just have to ask you Duke. YOu keep saying we are no longer on your hands. SO why the hell do you care anymore? let us go to hell if thats how it is. IF you continue to try to press god into our minds and "Souls" you will continue to have our on your hands as you say. So therefore you have failed ot teach us. and it is your fault. So to avoid this just dont try to do anything for us[/quote:66670]

no, its not his fault, he tried, that's all that he is supposed to do. It is hopeless here, but now, it is time to stop, now Duke, you are just making more people angry and hurting people's ideas of Christians

I wouldn't say he's hurting our idea of Christians.

I know many people who are Christians but they don't behave in that way at all.

Despite the repetitive and blinkered nature of his posts it's actually quite enjoyable reading.

Enjoyable as in watching a dog chase its tail enjoyable.

I thought I'd ignore this thread due to the table-tennis nature that it had engendered after the nth post, but no, I think there's still life in this old dog.

I better reload and shoot this old dog yet again. Its just repeating itself in new ways. I say we kill it now

What? Like they did lots of "bad stuff"? Or they didn't try to 'save' you?

[quote:3ccfb]

What? Like they did lots of "bad stuff"?[/quote:3ccfb]

No, they're just normal people who try to live normal lives, attend church on Sundays and do various other normal every-day things.

[quote:3ccfb]Or they didn't try to 'save' you?[/quote:3ccfb]

No, they don't. They, you know, talk to me. About things.

Anyone who continually spouted religion to me would not remain my friend for long.

If Heaven is to be full of people like that then I am quite glad I am not going there.

But, I can tell you this, I am not going to "Hell". It's as fictional as Gandalf, dwarves and my little pony.

When I die my brain will stop functioning and, seeing as I never witnessed anything before my brain started functioning, I would imagine that I would not be able to witness this "unending darkness, the gnashing of the teeth and undying fires".

I'll be dead. At peace. Finito. So long as my children and family live on, I am immortal.

That's what we are here for. That's what our bodies are designed to do, like every other single living organism on the planet.

Fucking shitter, really, but I intend to enjoy as much of it as I can. I don't need to fool myself into believing that when it is all over I will live a spiritual life on another plane.

Life is too bloody short to be worrying about what will happen after it. To live a rigid life restricted by rules written millenia ago by people who are long dead in some hope that I will earn my place in a fictional man-made fantasy is not my fucking idea of a good life.

And, until it is proven to exist, no matter how much you "accept" and "believe" in something, it is a fantasy.

I don't want to read another damned line about how religion is about morals and ideals - Duke_of_ray has blown that out of the water.

It's nothing to do with fucking morals. As he has said, Christianity is not about being a good person it is about accepting Jesus and God. If you do that, no matter how much of a twisted fuck you are, you will be saved and you will go to "Heaven".

What a crock of fucking shit.

Thanks.

The reason I keep on trying to tell you of Christ is becuase I care ofr you all, and I do not want any of you to go to hell. Christianity is about being good, but the acts alone do not save you, its Jesus, if you are a true Christian you will not go around killing people.


[quote:b45d1]I just have to ask you Duke. YOu keep saying we are no longer on your hands. SO why the hell do you care anymore? let us go to hell if thats how it is. IF you continue to try to press god into our minds and "Souls" you will continue to have our blood on your hands as you say. So therefore you have failed ot teach us. and it is your fault. So to avoid this just dont try to do anything for us [/quote:b45d1]

No its not on my hands, now its your choice, and your own fualt.


I hate for this thread to end with many of you still having lost souls, but maybe one day you will realize the truth and accept it. Good luck, and I will pray for you all.

quite sad really...

I'm a believer and don't care what others think about it.

good for you. And duke my soul is not lost. it is in me....not in the religious sence.....but yeah. thx for caring and all