Politics....
 

suck.

I'm really bored, so I figured I would start a thread bitching about how I hate politics. I feel all this government crap with wars and presidential elections are all crap. I can't stand them, I find politics to be the most boring subject. I dont care about economics, i dont care about the president, foreign relations, ANY of it. Those topics bore me and piss me off. Just because I dont care about all this doesnt make me Anti-American though.

I've been told im extremely mature for my age, but I'm not the government interactive kinda guy. Im more of the artsy, music loving, teenager. TV is eaten up by politics, the internet is eaten up, and its taken wayyy too far.

Well, lets not turn this into a flame war, lets hear your mature opinions.

i think you are naive in saying that you don't care about politics. I think everyone should have an understanding about them because it will ultimately affect their lives dramatically. It's alright hating to hear politics 24/7. Maybe you do know about politics and just don't care to discuss them (you didn't specify...sorry if i'm wrong).

[quote="Garry Coleman":94579]i think you are naive in saying that you don't care about politics. I think everyone should have an understanding about them because it will ultimately affect their lives dramatically. It's alright hating to hear politics 24/7. Maybe you do know about politics and just don't care to discuss them (you didn't specify...sorry if i'm wrong).[/quote:94579]

vote for me

[quote="Fluffy_Bunny":49e91]vote for me[/quote:49e91] happy: biggrin: oOo:

These baby boomer fuks are screwing over our generation. Who is gonna have to pay off all this war and defense spending? Who is probly never gonna see the SS $ we are paying in each of our paychecks? We all really need to get involved. And I really hope when you reach voting age (if you arent already) you DONT vote. I cant stand the people who vote for who they think is better looking or just because they are a "democrat" or "republican" know the issues and the politician's stance or else dont vote. If you let stupid people vote you get stupid government.

can't agree with you anymore. I've also seen Highschool students always say, "I'm a hardcore Democrat" or "I'm a hardcore republican" when they have noooooo idea what they stand for. The worst one is always, "I'm alllll about the Green Party BABY!!!11111 We want to legalize marijuana!!!11"

Re: Politics....
 

see: hippy

How can you not care about politic's, it's your future.

[quote="TGB!":1739b]Bullshit. Look up Americas GDP, and its production power. The bullshit "omg whos gonna pay for the war" is a liberal scare tactic. The only ones who can fuck up our econmoy (which is in recovery), is us. Meaning those of us on this forum right now. And quite frankly I'm more afraid of what you assholes are going to do in charge than my mother and her generation.

Bush isnt fucking up this government, Generation Y apathy will.[/quote:1739b]
So who is gonna pay? and WTF does GDP have to do with it? Ya we make alot of stuff... and? Its not just the war, its everything your generation has decided to put on its credit card bill. IMO, we need major government reforms. A large leap over to the socialist side of things would be a good step. Our social programs to date suck period. People take advantage of them and they just dont work well. Maybe thats just the American idiology and a socialism hybrid will never work here. Scandinavia has it down. Props to them. BTW us assholes will screw you old guys over as much as possible biggrin:

Oh BTW, Bush going into Iraq wasnt a fuk-up to you? please.... Why didnt his dad do it? why arent they talking to eachother now? It was a stupid move. But its ok, youguys voted him in. Like I said, you let stupid people vote, you get stupid government. I'll never feel safe with a president I could beat in a spelling bee.

MAn I wish we had some sort of "good" adolf hitler take over the government. Then all the problems would go away.

[quote:65015]So who is gonna pay? and WTF does GDP have to do with it? Ya we make alot of stuff... and? Its not just the war, its everything your generation has decided to put on its credit card bill. IMO, we need major government reforms. A large leap over to the socialist side of things would be a good step. Our social programs to date suck period. People take advantage of them and they just dont work well. Maybe thats just the American idiology and a socialism hybrid will never work here. Scandinavia has it down. Props to them. BTW us assholes will screw you old guys over as much as possible[/quote:65015]

I'm 23.

Americas social programs work, but they work too well. Thats the problem. It's far too easy to take advantage of. FDR started these program during the depression to get America out of its crash. But now these programs are used by minorities and immigrants who really do have it better than they did when they were in the old country. This isnt to say these programs are dominated by minorities (since its impossible with the caucassian to minority ratio), but a greater percentage of minorities are on welfare than whites.

Socialism doesnt work. America is as strong as it is, because of capatalism. Americans have the oppurtunity that they have because of capatalism. Show me a communist state that has worked? China. Sure if you like crushing government influence.

[quote="TGB!":865ff][quote:865ff]

Socialism doesnt work. America is as strong as it is, because of capatalism. Americans have the oppurtunity that they have because of capatalism. Show me a communist state that has worked? China. Sure if you like crushing government influence.[/quote:865ff][/quote:865ff]
* cough
excuse me!
where does this come from? That is TOTALLY baseless and dare I say it?, ignorant?

Take a look at scandanavian countries, Norway was recently ranked the best country in the world to live in. If you know anything, you would know they are very socialist influences up there. They are doing amazing! Anyways, the only way you may be correct is that our American mindset may not allow socialism to prosper, but it CERTAINLY can work and has worked and does work,

America is where it is becasue of Imperialism. Plain and simple. Hell throw in a little genocide if ya want. The worlds largest genocide happned here in NA. Native populations to say are what they are today becasue our anchestors eradicated them. America's history is just as brutal forceful as any other super power in world history. Get this out of your head eople. Power doesn't come to the good, it comes to the states governments that do crap that is beyond beleif. Hell America in the 20th centruy built itself off of a Military Industrial complex just like the Russians did. Wake up people their is more then to what you think. Your forefathers didnt pave the way for America's great economy Your MIlitary did. I don't want to come off as anti American "hell AMericans are great people" the thing is the government that has lead you threw these hundreds of years is no better then the one that led russia for 90. Your not any better moraly" and you are not worse. Just remember that America wasn't built on lolipops and sugar snaps. It was built on Weapons and the blood of thounsands of people. Just like nay other super power in histroy. People have to get this fact striaght in there head.

As for politic's. Well Like or lump um you need um.

uh..hello!...socialist europe doesnt mean socialist central america or eastern europe. they follow a democratic policy

[quote="Old Reliable":010d0]uh..hello!...socialist europe doesnt mean socialist central america or eastern europe. they follow a democratic policy[/quote:010d0]
Very true. But they are heavily influenced by socialism, a hybrid socialism that has worked very well. Good point though that may bot have been made clear.

[quote:0cb36]* cough
excuse me!
where does this come from? That is TOTALLY baseless and dare I say it?, ignorant?[/quote:0cb36]

I think you need to take a look at figures:

The US obviously ranks number ONE in GDP thus has a longer shelf life and ability to sustain itself. Scandinavian econmy: oil, high taxes, budget deficit. But of course we have a budget deficit as well, but we pull in 10,000 billion annually. THAT is the difference. Sustainability. Who's model can last longer?

politics are necessary and you should study them for many reasons.

1)most everything that involves your life involves the government. if you don't get to know that, then you will become an outcast.

2)whether you like it or not, you are part of the government. they have so much information on you and you become a part of the american system.

3)i have run out of ideas because i cannot fathom someone not caring about politics annoy:

[quote="TGB!":41c4b][quote:41c4b]* cough
excuse me!
where does this come from? That is TOTALLY baseless and dare I say it?, ignorant?[/quote:41c4b]

I think you need to take a look at figures:

The US obviously ranks number ONE in GDP thus has a longer shelf life and ability to sustain itself. Scandinavian econmy: oil, high taxes, budget deficit. But of course we have a budget deficit as well, but we pull in 10,000 billion annually. THAT is the difference. Sustainability. Who's model can last longer?[/quote:41c4b]
But ask yourself what does our huge GDP do for your everyday life? You wake up, go to work, come home to your family, sleep. Do that for 50 years, then HOPEFULLY have enough money to retire. Our huge GDP does not mean our system will last longer. Our system is less stable IMO. We are getting better at it, but we have lots of poverty. Norway have next to none.

what are you trying to say, that norway is a better country? no, not in terms of buying power, this country ranks #1. for one thing, norwegian beer tastes like shit, same with their chocolates

[quote="Old Reliable":0af8e]what are you trying to say, that norway is a better country? no, not in terms of buying power, this country ranks #1. for one thing, norwegian beer tastes like shit, same with their chocolates[/quote:0af8e]
haha I am saying if I had to choose, not knowing what class I would be born into, I would choose to be born into Norway over America. If I knew I would be born into the family I did here, I would choose America. And since when does a higher GDP make a country better? That is classic American thinking cool:

[quote="TGB!":f7dbf]Good lord. California has more people than Norway, and we have an unemployment rate of 6%, Scandanavia 4%. United States has a UR of 5.5.

Logically, the model that can most sustain itself is the one that will last. Thats just logic working for you. I work, 8-430, come home, party, sleep, go back to work. If I invest my money in a retirement plan, and am SMART about it, I will not have to rely on the government to take care of me because I will have taken care of myself. THAT is the basis of capatalism; individual accountability. It produces winners and losers, but at least my achievements are regulated by the government.[/quote:f7dbf]
Exactly! Thank you. In capitalism there are winners and losers. Just because you became a winner does that make our system better? Think of it out of the box a bit. People are not all smart. Should they be screwed because of that? Maybe you say yes. And what about those who never had a chance to begin with? When you are unemployed in a place like, for instance, denmark, the government pays for you to go back to school for as long as you want to learn and get back to a job. Here, they put you on welfare and let you mope around. (well technically you have to make an effort to find a job but that is easily faked)

[quote="TGB!":000cc]Quite frankly, I refuse to live in a country that handicaps progress over a pseudo-belief in equality that levels the playing field to accomodate for weakness. Do people have it tough - sure they do. 5% has it damn tough. But what about the other 95% This is a case of the minority dragging the majority down. Is that progress? No. Not at all. Competition breed progress and change. [/quote:000cc]

History's tyrants would agree with you. Where is a sense of compassion ? Tell me will all that money make you happy ? If won't I for one envy these country's for what they do and what they represent. They are an example all other nations should take a lesson from. Equality makes people happy, and is something that shows someones Ethics better.

[quote="TGB!":f9ed5]Quite frankly, I refuse to live in a country that handicaps progress over a pseudo-belief in equality that levels the playing field to accomodate for weakness. Do people have it tough - sure they do. 5% has it damn tough. But what about the other 95% This is a case of the minority dragging the majority down. Is that progress? No. Not at all. Competition breed progress and change. [/quote:f9ed5]
Where do those numbers come from may I ask?
And that is totally cool, you have your opinion. And I fully approve of the capitalism, socialism can still be worked in easily.
Interesting fact: In, IIRC, Norway, the CEO or any well paid employee of a company cannot make more than something like 20 times the salary of the lowest paid worker in that company (janitor etc) by law. I like that.

jujuman, you are an asshat. STFU and leave this thread. You've been put down by TGB and face it, he beat you with facts.




PS Clinton can suck my left testicle.

[quote="Short Hand":45fc1][quote="TGB!":45fc1]Quite frankly, I refuse to live in a country that handicaps progress over a pseudo-belief in equality that levels the playing field to accomodate for weakness. Do people have it tough - sure they do. 5% has it damn tough. But what about the other 95% This is a case of the minority dragging the majority down. Is that progress? No. Not at all. Competition breed progress and change. [/quote:45fc1]

History's tyrants would agree with you. Where is a sense of compassion ? Tell me will all that money make you happy ? If won't I for one envy these country's for what they do and what they represent. They are an example all other nations should take a lesson from. Equality makes people happy, and is something that shows someones Ethics better.[/quote:45fc1]
Yep. We live in a society and a culture that say money is what you live for. You should work as hard as possible to achieve money and to keep up with the jones'. It IS tough to try to see beyond that, I can agree. But if the jones' were a laid back family enjoying eachothers company with MR, jones working spareingly, wouldnt you do the same? Like I said, It would not be easy to work socialism into America.

If mobile phones count for anything biggrin:
http://www.aneki.com/phones.html

We can safely assume from this that socialist influences have done well for scandanavian countries, or else they just really like cell phones.

BTW just incase you wanted to see a source, there are more too.
http://www.aneki.com/best.html

[quote="Garry Coleman":12912]jujuman, you are an asshat. STFU and leave this thread. You've been put down by TGB and face it, he beat you with facts.




PS Clinton can suck my left testicle.[/quote:12912]

notb really.

People think equality is to hard to acheive. Truth is its only as hard as your mind makes it to be.

[quote="TGB!":6cc90]My bottom line is this. The sugar plum fairy image of everyone-equal despite your talent, is a nice thought, but flawed. America has problems yes, but innovation and progress are products of our system, not stagnation. I provided facts (links available upon request or you can just google - but it should be common sense), that says versus a Socialist government with a higher HDI, the unemployment rate of the United States is only 1.5% higher. 1.5! Shouldnt that number be significantly higher if Democratic Socialism is so much better than capatalism?

I work my ass off, and yanno what I dont mind doing it. Why? Because I'm proud of the work I do, and proud that I'm BETTER than the guy next to me. In your world, I bust my ass to cover the shortcomings of someone else, yet we still reap the same rewards. No thanks. CEO's and executives make more because for whatever reason they earned their spots. Is there rampant nepotism and favortism in this country. Hell yea. But there are also incredible success stories that would not be possible without capatalism. [/quote:6cc90]

SO would you say the Hilton Sisters earned their money ?

[quote="TGB!":c253c]My bottom line is this. The sugar plum fairy image of everyone-equal despite your talent, is a nice thought, but flawed. America has problems yes, but innovation and progress are products of our system, not stagnation. I provided facts (links available upon request or you can just google - but it should be common sense), that says versus a Socialist government with a higher HDI, the unemployment rate of the United States is only 1.5% higher. 1.5! Shouldnt that number be significantly higher if Democratic Socialism is so much better than capatalism?

I work my ass off, and yanno what I dont mind doing it. Why? Because I'm proud of the work I do, and proud that I'm BETTER than the guy next to me. In your world, I bust my ass to cover the shortcomings of someone else, yet we still reap the same rewards. No thanks. CEO's and executives make more because for whatever reason they earned their spots. Is there rampant nepotism and favortism in this country. Hell yea. But there are also incredible success stories that would not be possible without capatalism. [/quote:c253c]
First off, good post, I'll give it to ya, well written.
Most of the facts you quoted were beside the point. Especially the unemployment rates which mean nothing to my side of it. Unemployment is part of any economy with competition for jobs. You seem to be neglecting the fact that those countries have this too! Not much different than the US and thus, they have unemployment. The rear beautiful part comes in with what happens to those unemployed people. They are helped. Not just thrown money to get by, but re-educated and brought back into society. I hope you understand now that those unemployement facts mean little. Other than that, the rest of your post is strsight up you opinion and is a pretty solid one. I agree you shouldnt have to bust your ass to make up for someone else, but when everyone can work together, there is little to none of what you described. Granted, that is not easy to reach, but that is a goal of socialism. It has its downfalls as you mentioned just like we have, but if pulled off, it can be a great system.

I enjoy politics.

[quote="TGB!":2d00a]No. Her Grandfather (or great-grandfather) however did. What, you have millions and you're gonna make YOUR children work at McDonalds?[/quote:2d00a]

Now do you see the flaw in capitilism ? what happens when we have huge amounts ofp eople like them inheriting riches for which they do not deserve ? Ill tell you this they act a bit then run to be a politic for your state. It a joke, the strong get stronger while the weak get weaker.

[quote="TGB!":1f4a3]No. Her Grandfather (or great-grandfather) however did. What, you have millions and you're gonna make YOUR children work at McDonalds?[/quote:1f4a3]
Hell no! Is that fair though? Then there is the opposite of the spectrum where some people have NO chance to make it. Norway (sorry to keep using them as an example but they illustrate the system I condone very well), have 100% literacy over the age of 15. They all get the same education, granted it is easier with a smaller population but there is no reason it cant be done with a large one aswell. Where as the US collects taxes from the wealth passed on and invades Iraq with it :) jk