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Ydiss · 04-21-2003, 03:23 AM

I've noticed a lot of people saying that... Sniping in MOH isn't skillful because it's not realistic.

No shit.

But, excusing the fact that there's no sway, no bullet drop, no atmospheric effects and no zoom delay, the question was who is the best?

It's like everything in any game. It may not require a hell of a lot of skill to use a weapon (Sniper, shotgun, smg, mg, er rifle - I've seen it said... "Lamer rifle user!") but this does not mean someone will not be able to rape you with the same gun that you're using because they are way more skillful at the game than you.

Just because you've killed (or been killed) a thousand times with (or by) a sniper rifle on maps like DV, Omaha and Hunt doesn't mean that it's a weapon without skill.

You will know when you meet a skillful sniper. It's normaly about the time you think you've encountered a cheater.

Skillful sniping does not mean sitting still and popping people off at a distance. Hey, it may be in real life and in other games but MoH is neither of those, it's an arcade-cum-sim (with more arcade tendancies). I would agree that anyone can do this.

The ultimate sniper can camp, move, camp, move. He can pre-empt you when you approach (by using sound - not hacks as they're often accused of) they know how the map works (where you will spawn roughly when you die, where someone is likely to be, what that sound means from that direction, and what this sound means from there). They will know when to retreat and where to retreat to, they will be able to lure you in with your SMG, shotgun or MG and pop you as your head emerges. They will be able to pop you at mid-distance in a strafe-fight. They will pop you at maximum range while you're trying to pepper them.

They will win in any one-on-one with any weapon because one it's hit and you're dead (this is, of course, excluding realism - that could be said of any weapon in realism).

They will know when standing still is dangerous but they will also know roughly how much time they do have to stand still to make their next shot tell. Even if they can't make a shot tell, the best snipers will pop at you anyway. If you don't die on the first shot you will on the second, be it another sniper round or from their pistol.

A sniper can clear a room of 2-3+ people without dying if he knows who to shoot first. There's a lot of skill in measuring who is a threat to you, who is about to die (so you can steal the kill with a well aimed shot) and who to leave until the last shot because they are the least threat. Anyone can do this (not just snipers) but only the most skilled snipers can do this and win.

There is so much more to sniping than some people think. There is only so much you can do with shotguns and smgs/mgs before it's all been done before.

This doesn't mean they are all without skill, they aren't. An excellent SMGer will cane an average one. An excellent shotgunner will cane a poor one.

An excellent sniper however, will cane them all. I've seen it.

My point is not that the sniper rifle is the best or most skilled weapon to use... It isn't really. It can be depending on the opposition and the sniper, but it's still quite a balanced weapon.

My point is that saying snipers are easy and take no skill to use is falsehood. If you say that then you may as well say none of the weapons take skill, we're all just the same ability and it's as easy as point and click. What would be the point in playing?

No weapon requires skill to use. They all require skill to master, though.

Anyway, I remember Soviet being a good sniper. This was a long time ago, though.

I've seen many better on European servers since but that's not surprising, it's been a long time.

Without false modesty I'm quite proficient with the sniper (since I upgraded my machine at least) but I have been matched and beaten a good few times on local servers.

It's impossible to say who is the best out there. There are lots of very very good ones to pick from.

I would love to drop by the AAN or aM server sometime but it's not going to be good for sniping due to the lag I'd get. I'll give it a try though.

	(#45)
Ydiss is Offline Senior Member Posts: 2,377 Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Nottingham, England	04-21-2003, 03:23 AM I've noticed a lot of people saying that... Sniping in MOH isn't skillful because it's not realistic. No shit. But, excusing the fact that there's no sway, no bullet drop, no atmospheric effects and no zoom delay, the question was who is the best? It's like everything in any game. It may not require a hell of a lot of skill to use a weapon (Sniper, shotgun, smg, mg, er rifle - I've seen it said... "Lamer rifle user!") but this does not mean someone will not be able to rape you with the same gun that you're using because they are way more skillful at the game than you. Just because you've killed (or been killed) a thousand times with (or by) a sniper rifle on maps like DV, Omaha and Hunt doesn't mean that it's a weapon without skill. You will know when you meet a skillful sniper. It's normaly about the time you think you've encountered a cheater. Skillful sniping does not mean sitting still and popping people off at a distance. Hey, it may be in real life and in other games but MoH is neither of those, it's an arcade-cum-sim (with more arcade tendancies). I would agree that anyone can do this. The ultimate sniper can camp, move, camp, move. He can pre-empt you when you approach (by using sound - not hacks as they're often accused of) they know how the map works (where you will spawn roughly when you die, where someone is likely to be, what that sound means from that direction, and what this sound means from there). They will know when to retreat and where to retreat to, they will be able to lure you in with your SMG, shotgun or MG and pop you as your head emerges. They will be able to pop you at mid-distance in a strafe-fight. They will pop you at maximum range while you're trying to pepper them. They will win in any one-on-one with any weapon because one it's hit and you're dead (this is, of course, excluding realism - that could be said of any weapon in realism). They will know when standing still is dangerous but they will also know roughly how much time they do have to stand still to make their next shot tell. Even if they can't make a shot tell, the best snipers will pop at you anyway. If you don't die on the first shot you will on the second, be it another sniper round or from their pistol. A sniper can clear a room of 2-3+ people without dying if he knows who to shoot first. There's a lot of skill in measuring who is a threat to you, who is about to die (so you can steal the kill with a well aimed shot) and who to leave until the last shot because they are the least threat. Anyone can do this (not just snipers) but only the most skilled snipers can do this and win. There is so much more to sniping than some people think. There is only so much you can do with shotguns and smgs/mgs before it's all been done before. This doesn't mean they are all without skill, they aren't. An excellent SMGer will cane an average one. An excellent shotgunner will cane a poor one. An excellent sniper however, will cane them all. I've seen it. My point is not that the sniper rifle is the best or most skilled weapon to use... It isn't really. It can be depending on the opposition and the sniper, but it's still quite a balanced weapon. My point is that saying snipers are easy and take no skill to use is falsehood. If you say that then you may as well say none of the weapons take skill, we're all just the same ability and it's as easy as point and click. What would be the point in playing? No weapon requires skill to use. They all require skill to master, though. Anyway, I remember Soviet being a good sniper. This was a long time ago, though. I've seen many better on European servers since but that's not surprising, it's been a long time. Without false modesty I'm quite proficient with the sniper (since I upgraded my machine at least) but I have been matched and beaten a good few times on local servers. It's impossible to say who is the best out there. There are lots of very very good ones to pick from. I would love to drop by the AAN or aM server sometime but it's not going to be good for sniping due to the lag I'd get. I'll give it a try though.