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TGB! · 07-02-2004, 12:20 AM

[quote:d8cae] Why did Bush oppose the 9/11 commisions at first ?[/quote:d8cae]

I dont know. And neither do you. To say you do is presumptous.

[quote:d8cae] Not to mention the fact that they asked the 9/11 commision to Censor 28 pages of their report. "ever wonder what is on those pages".[/quote:d8cae]

Theres a reason we call certain bits of information classified. This isnt “what library books did so and so check out”, this is information that no doubt compromises, or relates to ongoing investigations. But again thats presumptious to think I know whats on there and you know whats on there. This is not the first, and last, time this will happen.

[quote:d8cae] + as stated in the movie relating to the Bin Laden family, when you investigate any crime such as murder for say, you always question the family.[/quote:d8cae]

You understand dont you, that the FBI reviewed the crew manifest. They KNEW who was on this plane. You understand that dont you.

[quote:d8cae] The state is goverened by Jeff Bush[/quote:d8cae]

Jeb

[quote:d8cae] -The chairmen of Bush Campeign (Katherine Harris) was also the Vote counter for Florida[/quote:d8cae]

No she actually is the secretary of State. She certifies the results, the State Registrars offifce sets up polling places. You do realize that in most of these polling places where votes were “lost” that they were run by democrats.

[quote:d8cae] and and hired a company to knock voters off the list that would most likely not vote for Bush (aka such as African Americans.)[/quote:d8cae]

This “company” is the ChoicePoint corporation. There task was to take the large registered voter list, and to REMOVE CONVICTED FELONS who do not have the right to vote. It is true that 97% were felons and the other 3% of these (which amounts to 3000) were wrongfully excised. HALF of those were minorities (not simply blacks, although I know to some minority is just another term for “blacks”). So you have 1500 people who may or may not have actually gone to the polls, and voted for Al Gore. Funny thing is Al Gore neither protested the so-called “disenfranchisement” nor supported the felons right to regain their vote.

[quote:d8cae] More backup and proof to this clause of African Americans getting knocked off the list was in joint session of congress and the Senate[/quote:d8cae]

First things, congress is the Senate and The House Of Representatives. “Congress” is not a single legislative house.

[quote:d8cae]African American Congress men and women both stood up to argue and call mis conduct in Florida. They needed backup from a senator but didn't get any.[/quote:d8cae]

Perhaps because the Senators respected the decision of the Supreme Court? You realize the Senate ALSO has minorities in it as well, correct? And you do realize that if the Representatives (these are the guys who conduct business in The House, and serve smaller districts than the Senate) had NOT “stood up” for their constituents, they no doubt would have been removed from office? See Reps serve only two years in office, so they are under the gun to serve the constituents whether they want to or not. Again this is conjecture to their motives, but not bringing their constituents “complaints” to the floor of the Senate would have been career suicide.

[quote:d8cae] So they were told to shut up and sit down.[/quote:d8cae]

No, they were told to respect the rules of the Senate floor which do not allow debate. Moore took that to mean “shut up and sit down”, cause what sounds “jucier”.

[quote:d8cae] One of the Congress Women who came up for this stated that in one of the sections alone 16000 blacks were disin franchised (lost right to vote) in Florida.[/quote:d8cae]

Thats a patently false number. I dont even know how to respond to that except to say power of persuasion is a great thing. “Hey they say some folks voted for the wrong person, you think maybe you voted for the wrong person – yea I think I voted wrong too! Damnit I lost my vote”

[quote:d8cae] Also numerous independent counts point out the Gore won the state.[/quote:d8cae]

I already covered this. Depending on the “rules” used, either Gore or Bush would take FL.

[quote:d8cae] doens't mattter if Clark takes the wrap, such high profile people being allowed to leave is to much of a fuck up.[/quote:d8cae]

Already addressed this. I will say though, that theres a real underlying sense of racism going on to assume that all Saudis are by virtue of the nation of birth are “suspect”.

[quote:d8cae] Lets see some examples of terrorists being harbored in Iraq after Spet 11th ?[/quote:d8cae]

You know they werent there? “Oh hey Saddam we know some of Osamas men have been here in the past, training on your soil for various activities, but since they arent here right now we’re gonna go ahead and let you off the hook”. Yea, real good plan. You’re willing to hold the Bin Ladens w/o them having any involvement in 9/11 but dont give a shit that Hussein has a very real history with terrorist groups INCLUDING Al Qaeda? Sweet.

[quote:d8cae] Thats right their were no links of AL queda to Iraq.[/quote:d8cae]

IN regards to 9/11, no there werent.

[quote:d8cae] If you use these weak statemetns to justify the invasion of Iraq and the killing of men women and children, then maybe you should review your own ethics.[/quote:d8cae]

No, I’d like the left to review the “ethics” that allows dictators to murder their own people, and then “stand up for their rights” when we remove these murderers. Where was your righteous indignation then Short Hand when this was happening? Where were the protest when Hussein invaded Kuwait, when the Baath party systematically murdered Kurds? Where were you then?

[quote:d8cae] And in closure, yes there is Liberal Bias in Moore's film's , because it is a liberal peice of media, but a conservative media peice would be bias as well, Moore admits his bias in public and states this is his opinion.[/quote:d8cae]

Moore has a “fact checker team” – hired by him of course – to check his “facts”. This is not an “opinion” piece. Moore is presenting this as “fact”.

[quote:d8cae] In the end all it seems to me is that you don't see how valuble life is maybe one day if you ever are so unlucky to live threw the hell that is "war" then you might understand.[/quote:d8cae]

No I lived through 10 years of “the ghetto” under a democrat and quite frankly didnt see much of the “liberals love education, minorities, and blah blah blah”. I did however see more than a few people close to me get shuffled on off to the afterlife and did see more than a few people get “disenfranchised” by government in general. This is in the most liberal state in the United States also – California.

[quote:d8cae]Life is to valueble to be wasting on such falsities such as the War in Iraq.[/quote:d8cae]

Tell that to Saddam Hussein.

	(#44)
TGB! is Offline Command Sergeant Major Posts: 2,644 Join Date: Dec 2003	07-02-2004, 12:20 AM [quote:d8cae] Why did Bush oppose the 9/11 commisions at first ?[/quote:d8cae] I dont know. And neither do you. To say you do is presumptous. [quote:d8cae] Not to mention the fact that they asked the 9/11 commision to Censor 28 pages of their report. "ever wonder what is on those pages".[/quote:d8cae] Theres a reason we call certain bits of information classified. This isnt “what library books did so and so check out”, this is information that no doubt compromises, or relates to ongoing investigations. But again thats presumptious to think I know whats on there and you know whats on there. This is not the first, and last, time this will happen. [quote:d8cae] + as stated in the movie relating to the Bin Laden family, when you investigate any crime such as murder for say, you always question the family.[/quote:d8cae] You understand dont you, that the FBI reviewed the crew manifest. They KNEW who was on this plane. You understand that dont you. [quote:d8cae] The state is goverened by Jeff Bush[/quote:d8cae] Jeb [quote:d8cae] -The chairmen of Bush Campeign (Katherine Harris) was also the Vote counter for Florida[/quote:d8cae] No she actually is the secretary of State. She certifies the results, the State Registrars offifce sets up polling places. You do realize that in most of these polling places where votes were “lost” that they were run by democrats. [quote:d8cae] and and hired a company to knock voters off the list that would most likely not vote for Bush (aka such as African Americans.)[/quote:d8cae] This “company” is the ChoicePoint corporation. There task was to take the large registered voter list, and to REMOVE CONVICTED FELONS who do not have the right to vote. It is true that 97% were felons and the other 3% of these (which amounts to 3000) were wrongfully excised. HALF of those were minorities (not simply blacks, although I know to some minority is just another term for “blacks”). So you have 1500 people who may or may not have actually gone to the polls, and voted for Al Gore. Funny thing is Al Gore neither protested the so-called “disenfranchisement” nor supported the felons right to regain their vote. [quote:d8cae] More backup and proof to this clause of African Americans getting knocked off the list was in joint session of congress and the Senate[/quote:d8cae] First things, congress is the Senate and The House Of Representatives. “Congress” is not a single legislative house. [quote:d8cae]African American Congress men and women both stood up to argue and call mis conduct in Florida. They needed backup from a senator but didn't get any.[/quote:d8cae] Perhaps because the Senators respected the decision of the Supreme Court? You realize the Senate ALSO has minorities in it as well, correct? And you do realize that if the Representatives (these are the guys who conduct business in The House, and serve smaller districts than the Senate) had NOT “stood up” for their constituents, they no doubt would have been removed from office? See Reps serve only two years in office, so they are under the gun to serve the constituents whether they want to or not. Again this is conjecture to their motives, but not bringing their constituents “complaints” to the floor of the Senate would have been career suicide. [quote:d8cae] So they were told to shut up and sit down.[/quote:d8cae] No, they were told to respect the rules of the Senate floor which do not allow debate. Moore took that to mean “shut up and sit down”, cause what sounds “jucier”. [quote:d8cae] One of the Congress Women who came up for this stated that in one of the sections alone 16000 blacks were disin franchised (lost right to vote) in Florida.[/quote:d8cae] Thats a patently false number. I dont even know how to respond to that except to say power of persuasion is a great thing. “Hey they say some folks voted for the wrong person, you think maybe you voted for the wrong person – yea I think I voted wrong too! Damnit I lost my vote” [quote:d8cae] Also numerous independent counts point out the Gore won the state.[/quote:d8cae] I already covered this. Depending on the “rules” used, either Gore or Bush would take FL. [quote:d8cae] doens't mattter if Clark takes the wrap, such high profile people being allowed to leave is to much of a fuck up.[/quote:d8cae] Already addressed this. I will say though, that theres a real underlying sense of racism going on to assume that all Saudis are by virtue of the nation of birth are “suspect”. [quote:d8cae] Lets see some examples of terrorists being harbored in Iraq after Spet 11th ?[/quote:d8cae] You know they werent there? “Oh hey Saddam we know some of Osamas men have been here in the past, training on your soil for various activities, but since they arent here right now we’re gonna go ahead and let you off the hook”. Yea, real good plan. You’re willing to hold the Bin Ladens w/o them having any involvement in 9/11 but dont give a shit that Hussein has a very real history with terrorist groups INCLUDING Al Qaeda? Sweet. [quote:d8cae] Thats right their were no links of AL queda to Iraq.[/quote:d8cae] IN regards to 9/11, no there werent. [quote:d8cae] If you use these weak statemetns to justify the invasion of Iraq and the killing of men women and children, then maybe you should review your own ethics.[/quote:d8cae] No, I’d like the left to review the “ethics” that allows dictators to murder their own people, and then “stand up for their rights” when we remove these murderers. Where was your righteous indignation then Short Hand when this was happening? Where were the protest when Hussein invaded Kuwait, when the Baath party systematically murdered Kurds? Where were you then? [quote:d8cae] And in closure, yes there is Liberal Bias in Moore's film's , because it is a liberal peice of media, but a conservative media peice would be bias as well, Moore admits his bias in public and states this is his opinion.[/quote:d8cae] Moore has a “fact checker team” – hired by him of course – to check his “facts”. This is not an “opinion” piece. Moore is presenting this as “fact”. [quote:d8cae] In the end all it seems to me is that you don't see how valuble life is maybe one day if you ever are so unlucky to live threw the hell that is "war" then you might understand.[/quote:d8cae] No I lived through 10 years of “the ghetto” under a democrat and quite frankly didnt see much of the “liberals love education, minorities, and blah blah blah”. I did however see more than a few people close to me get shuffled on off to the afterlife and did see more than a few people get “disenfranchised” by government in general. This is in the most liberal state in the United States also – California. [quote:d8cae]Life is to valueble to be wasting on such falsities such as the War in Iraq.[/quote:d8cae] Tell that to Saddam Hussein.