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Short Hand · 07-02-2004, 03:56 AM

[quote:0cadc]I dont know. And neither do you. To say you do is presumptous.
[/quote:0cadc]

What possible reason could he have for stoping a 911 commision please tell me ? Or better yet explain that to the 911 victims they will be more then glad to hear any of your reasoning.

[quote:0cadc]Theres a reason we call certain bits of information classified. This isnt “what library books did so and so check out”, this is information that no doubt compromises, or relates to ongoing investigations. But again thats presumptious to think I know whats on there and you know whats on there. This is not the first, and last, time this will happen.
[/quote:0cadc]

How could a fianl report and sum up of the investigation on 911 possibly have nay thing that could hinder the investigations findings when it is already done ?(what possibly in this report on 911 could hinder security of the USA ?) The only reason to censor the information would be because it has incriminating evidence towards the Bush Administration. Thats why they censored the pages. Until they show them this will be my thoughts on those pages. You can assume what you want to as well, but where I come from if you dont want people to see it it obviously has something bad on it. Also how are you so trust worthy of an administratin which has lied so much ? you would think that you would be curious to say the least to know about these pages.

[quote:0cadc]Jeb
[/quote:0cadc]

Talking to gehof (jeff) from cod.org at the time of typing this, mixed up the two names in between typing to him on msn and typing to respond to this thread.

[quote:0cadc]No she actually is the secretary of State. She certifies the results, the State Registrars offifce sets up polling places. You do realize that in most of these polling places where votes were “lost” that they were run by democrats. [/quote:0cadc]

Point being she was Bush's Campeign manager at the time as well. Wow thats not the least bit suspicious...

[quote:0cadc]This “company” is the ChoicePoint corporation. There task was to take the large registered voter list, and to REMOVE CONVICTED FELONS who do not have the right to vote. It is true that 97% were felons and the other 3% of these (which amounts to 3000) were wrongfully excised. HALF of those were minorities (not simply blacks, although I know to some minority is just another term for “blacks”). So you have 1500 people who may or may not have actually gone to the polls, and voted for Al Gore. Funny thing is Al Gore neither protested the so-called “disenfranchisement” nor supported the felons right to regain their vote.[/quote:0cadc]

wrong again. The company at the time (i have no idea of the current company unless it changed etc.) was database Technologies located at 4530 Blue Lake Corporation Center Florida, Trust me those 1500" voters would have put Gore into office. Gore didn't argue any of this and neither did the democratic party itself, it seems they just accepted it. WHich baffels me..

[quote:0cadc]First things, congress is the Senate and The House Of Representatives. “Congress” is not a single legislative house [/quote:0cadc]

all I was trying to say was it was a joint session. not elaborate or get into the details of any of that.

[quote:0cadc]Perhaps because the Senators respected the decision of the Supreme Court? You realize the Senate ALSO has minorities in it as well, correct? And you do realize that if the Representatives (these are the guys who conduct business in The House, and serve smaller districts than the Senate) had NOT “stood up” for their constituents, they no doubt would have been removed from office? See Reps serve only two years in office, so they are under the gun to serve the constituents whether they want to or not. Again this is conjecture to their motives, but not bringing their constituents “complaints” to the floor of the Senate would have been career suicide.
[/quote:0cadc]

I laughed at this one.

if you call 3 minorities on the senate something for the Black Congress members to look to for support. This is the only black member on the senate

wow she is very..black...
[img]http://boxer.senate.gov/i/leftmargin.jpg[/img]

and 2 Senators from Hawaii. (Hawain) 2 of these minorities Senators are backbenchers (as we call them in Canada) and 1 is fairly prominent. NOw if you think that 2 senators that are hawain are going to risk their career for a black person from congress, then you got naother thing coming, they might as well be white just like ALL of the other members in the Senate. As for Boxer, that ain't black. SO minorities support in the senate does not seem like its their as you claim, which amazes why you would not look over the ones who are there. If only support had been their, if someone had the balls to maybe even question the disfranchisement. better safe then sorry.

[quote:0cadc]No, they were told to respect the rules of the Senate floor which do not allow debate. Moore took that to mean “shut up and sit down”, cause what sounds “jucier”. [/quote:0cadc]

It is what most minorities would take it as well, to be told to shut up and sit down, you an be told to shut up in polite ways you know. "yes is is jucier" what should he have said in the movie ? to be quiet ? get real.

[quote:0cadc]Thats a patently false number. I dont even know how to respond to that except to say power of persuasion is a great thing. “Hey they say some folks voted for the wrong person, you think maybe you voted for the wrong person – yea I think I voted wrong too! Damnit I lost my vote”
[/quote:0cadc]

put your money where your mouth is and prove her wrong, email her ask her yourself.

[quote:0cadc]Already addressed this. I will say though, that theres a real underlying sense of racism going on to assume that all Saudis are by virtue of the nation of birth are “suspect”. [/quote:0cadc]

the ones on those planes were, not "all" Saudis. your planting racism here because you have no real arguement to really debate, why they just let these guyz go. Or would it have been to racist to have held them in custody and question them about a few things ? again go tell that to the 911 victims and their family's. Im sure they would love to hear you.

[quote:0cadc]You know they werent there? “Oh hey Saddam we know some of Osamas men have been here in the past, training on your soil for various activities, but since they arent here right now we’re gonna go ahead and let you off the hook”. Yea, real good plan. You’re willing to hold the Bin Ladens w/o them having any involvement in 9/11 but dont give a shit that Hussein has a very real history with terrorist groups INCLUDING Al Qaeda? Sweet . [/quote:0cadc]

so why not go invade Saudi arabia for funding them ? why not go to pakistan to root out all the danm facilities that are their as well, Al Queda is everywhere even in Asian countries, yet I have not seen any US soldiers go there. Fact is this happens in any muslim contry this terror cells are every where yet you are only in Iraq. Yes i will hold the bin ladens to question them and ask them about as much as I can. This is not hurting them only causing them a bit of a inconvience, if you consider this to horrible a thing to do "then again go tell that to the people of 9/11. Honestly if you use this to justify the invasion of Iraq you are fucked.

[quote:0cadc]IN regards to 9/11, no there werent.[/quote:0cadc]

so ? Saudi Arabia has tides to Iraq double time as in 9/11 and in all other respects. Hell they even fund millions of dollers into AL Queda, yet you don't seem to be wanting to invade SA. ?

[quote:0cadc]No, I’d like the left to review the “ethics” that allows dictators to murder their own people, and then “stand up for their rights” when we remove these murderers. Where was your righteous indignation then Short Hand when this was happening? Where were the protest when Hussein invaded Kuwait, when the Baath party systematically murdered Kurds? Where were you then?[/quote:0cadc]

The Kurd masscre was a horrid event, 5000 ethnic Kurds were killed in Iraq, But then again thousands more were killed in the invasion of Iraq then all the Kurds killed in the Chemical attacks by Ali (Suddams chemical weapons general). More Iraqi Civilians are supposedly dead after the bombings on baghdad alone. + the civilians killed everyday and the 1000 + US soldiers being killed daily, The prisoner Abuses, The bagging and random house invasion by soldiers into innocent Iraqi's homes. The explosive Kurdish population in the north which may revolt for independence, even after that most likely get into a war (with turkey) cuasing thousands more dead. (Kurd's in Turkey want independence as welL) Don't play the ethics game with me becasue for every action the US has taken has caused thousnads of Civilian casulty's. Not to mention the outrage in the Arab world and the beheading of various people. Ethic's are not on your side, besides is starting a war over oil really ethical ? gimme a break. you have no standing on this. Besides is waging a full scale war, bombing civilian targets really ethical ? Besides their was a mass genocide of millions in fucking Rwanda, North Korea has WMDS and maeans of deploying them + a whole wad of horros going on in other country's. Why is their an invasion of Iraq but not these countries ? now where have those ethics gone again.....

[quote:0cadc]Moore has a “fact checker team” – hired by him of course – to check his “facts”. This is not an “opinion” piece. Moore is presenting this as “fact”. [/quote:0cadc]

Then if what he is saying is true??? why are you argueing it ? seems you just shut yourself down.

[quote:0cadc]No I lived through 10 years of “the ghetto” under a democrat and quite frankly didnt see much of the “liberals love education, minorities, and blah blah blah”. I did however see more than a few people close to me get shuffled on off to the afterlife and did see more than a few people get “disenfranchised” by government in general. This is in the most liberal state in the United States also – California.
[/quote:0cadc]

I lived for years under the Mulroney Conservative government in Canada, they put this nation into a deficit 42billion to be exact, and for a Country like Canada that hurts. I lived under Mike "The Knife" Harris in Onatrio for most of my older school career, what I saw was education cutbacks and the quality of life in general go from somewhat stable to shit. Welfare which at one point my mom was on was almost denied to her, The Hospital waits are unbareble because Provincial Conservatives were not willing o raise spending onHealthcare from federal cuts. There is a truckload of Conservative fuck ups here as well, point being or "whati m trying to say is, They don't always work out. SOme do some don't. To let you know I lived downtown Toronto for 7 years as a kid in declineing North York area. I know what a ghetto is and have experienced it, so lets not get into all of that, as for people passing away, I've seen many go by my ways as well. God Bless them.

[quote:0cadc]Tell that to Saddam Hussein. [/quote:0cadc]

Tell that to Bush.

(but then again i'm only a trained ape...)

	(#48)
Short Hand is Offline Brigadier General Posts: 10,721 Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: C-eH-N-eH-D-eH eH?	07-02-2004, 03:56 AM [quote:0cadc]I dont know. And neither do you. To say you do is presumptous. [/quote:0cadc] What possible reason could he have for stoping a 911 commision please tell me ? Or better yet explain that to the 911 victims they will be more then glad to hear any of your reasoning. [quote:0cadc]Theres a reason we call certain bits of information classified. This isnt “what library books did so and so check out”, this is information that no doubt compromises, or relates to ongoing investigations. But again thats presumptious to think I know whats on there and you know whats on there. This is not the first, and last, time this will happen. [/quote:0cadc] How could a fianl report and sum up of the investigation on 911 possibly have nay thing that could hinder the investigations findings when it is already done ?(what possibly in this report on 911 could hinder security of the USA ?) The only reason to censor the information would be because it has incriminating evidence towards the Bush Administration. Thats why they censored the pages. Until they show them this will be my thoughts on those pages. You can assume what you want to as well, but where I come from if you dont want people to see it it obviously has something bad on it. Also how are you so trust worthy of an administratin which has lied so much ? you would think that you would be curious to say the least to know about these pages. [quote:0cadc]Jeb [/quote:0cadc] Talking to gehof (jeff) from cod.org at the time of typing this, mixed up the two names in between typing to him on msn and typing to respond to this thread. [quote:0cadc]No she actually is the secretary of State. She certifies the results, the State Registrars offifce sets up polling places. You do realize that in most of these polling places where votes were “lost” that they were run by democrats. [/quote:0cadc] Point being she was Bush's Campeign manager at the time as well. Wow thats not the least bit suspicious... [quote:0cadc]This “company” is the ChoicePoint corporation. There task was to take the large registered voter list, and to REMOVE CONVICTED FELONS who do not have the right to vote. It is true that 97% were felons and the other 3% of these (which amounts to 3000) were wrongfully excised. HALF of those were minorities (not simply blacks, although I know to some minority is just another term for “blacks”). So you have 1500 people who may or may not have actually gone to the polls, and voted for Al Gore. Funny thing is Al Gore neither protested the so-called “disenfranchisement” nor supported the felons right to regain their vote.[/quote:0cadc] wrong again. The company at the time (i have no idea of the current company unless it changed etc.) was database Technologies located at 4530 Blue Lake Corporation Center Florida, Trust me those 1500" voters would have put Gore into office. Gore didn't argue any of this and neither did the democratic party itself, it seems they just accepted it. WHich baffels me.. [quote:0cadc]First things, congress is the Senate and The House Of Representatives. “Congress” is not a single legislative house [/quote:0cadc] all I was trying to say was it was a joint session. not elaborate or get into the details of any of that. [quote:0cadc]Perhaps because the Senators respected the decision of the Supreme Court? You realize the Senate ALSO has minorities in it as well, correct? And you do realize that if the Representatives (these are the guys who conduct business in The House, and serve smaller districts than the Senate) had NOT “stood up” for their constituents, they no doubt would have been removed from office? See Reps serve only two years in office, so they are under the gun to serve the constituents whether they want to or not. Again this is conjecture to their motives, but not bringing their constituents “complaints” to the floor of the Senate would have been career suicide. [/quote:0cadc] I laughed at this one. if you call 3 minorities on the senate something for the Black Congress members to look to for support. This is the only black member on the senate wow she is very..black... [img]http://boxer.senate.gov/i/leftmargin.jpg[/img] and 2 Senators from Hawaii. (Hawain) 2 of these minorities Senators are backbenchers (as we call them in Canada) and 1 is fairly prominent. NOw if you think that 2 senators that are hawain are going to risk their career for a black person from congress, then you got naother thing coming, they might as well be white just like ALL of the other members in the Senate. As for Boxer, that ain't black. SO minorities support in the senate does not seem like its their as you claim, which amazes why you would not look over the ones who are there. If only support had been their, if someone had the balls to maybe even question the disfranchisement. better safe then sorry. [quote:0cadc]No, they were told to respect the rules of the Senate floor which do not allow debate. Moore took that to mean “shut up and sit down”, cause what sounds “jucier”. [/quote:0cadc] It is what most minorities would take it as well, to be told to shut up and sit down, you an be told to shut up in polite ways you know. "yes is is jucier" what should he have said in the movie ? to be quiet ? get real. [quote:0cadc]Thats a patently false number. I dont even know how to respond to that except to say power of persuasion is a great thing. “Hey they say some folks voted for the wrong person, you think maybe you voted for the wrong person – yea I think I voted wrong too! Damnit I lost my vote” [/quote:0cadc] put your money where your mouth is and prove her wrong, email her ask her yourself. [quote:0cadc]Already addressed this. I will say though, that theres a real underlying sense of racism going on to assume that all Saudis are by virtue of the nation of birth are “suspect”. [/quote:0cadc] the ones on those planes were, not "all" Saudis. your planting racism here because you have no real arguement to really debate, why they just let these guyz go. Or would it have been to racist to have held them in custody and question them about a few things ? again go tell that to the 911 victims and their family's. Im sure they would love to hear you. [quote:0cadc]You know they werent there? “Oh hey Saddam we know some of Osamas men have been here in the past, training on your soil for various activities, but since they arent here right now we’re gonna go ahead and let you off the hook”. Yea, real good plan. You’re willing to hold the Bin Ladens w/o them having any involvement in 9/11 but dont give a shit that Hussein has a very real history with terrorist groups INCLUDING Al Qaeda? Sweet . [/quote:0cadc] so why not go invade Saudi arabia for funding them ? why not go to pakistan to root out all the danm facilities that are their as well, Al Queda is everywhere even in Asian countries, yet I have not seen any US soldiers go there. Fact is this happens in any muslim contry this terror cells are every where yet you are only in Iraq. Yes i will hold the bin ladens to question them and ask them about as much as I can. This is not hurting them only causing them a bit of a inconvience, if you consider this to horrible a thing to do "then again go tell that to the people of 9/11. Honestly if you use this to justify the invasion of Iraq you are fucked. [quote:0cadc]IN regards to 9/11, no there werent.[/quote:0cadc] so ? Saudi Arabia has tides to Iraq double time as in 9/11 and in all other respects. Hell they even fund millions of dollers into AL Queda, yet you don't seem to be wanting to invade SA. ? [quote:0cadc]No, I’d like the left to review the “ethics” that allows dictators to murder their own people, and then “stand up for their rights” when we remove these murderers. Where was your righteous indignation then Short Hand when this was happening? Where were the protest when Hussein invaded Kuwait, when the Baath party systematically murdered Kurds? Where were you then?[/quote:0cadc] The Kurd masscre was a horrid event, 5000 ethnic Kurds were killed in Iraq, But then again thousands more were killed in the invasion of Iraq then all the Kurds killed in the Chemical attacks by Ali (Suddams chemical weapons general). More Iraqi Civilians are supposedly dead after the bombings on baghdad alone. + the civilians killed everyday and the 1000 + US soldiers being killed daily, The prisoner Abuses, The bagging and random house invasion by soldiers into innocent Iraqi's homes. The explosive Kurdish population in the north which may revolt for independence, even after that most likely get into a war (with turkey) cuasing thousands more dead. (Kurd's in Turkey want independence as welL) Don't play the ethics game with me becasue for every action the US has taken has caused thousnads of Civilian casulty's. Not to mention the outrage in the Arab world and the beheading of various people. Ethic's are not on your side, besides is starting a war over oil really ethical ? gimme a break. you have no standing on this. Besides is waging a full scale war, bombing civilian targets really ethical ? Besides their was a mass genocide of millions in fucking Rwanda, North Korea has WMDS and maeans of deploying them + a whole wad of horros going on in other country's. Why is their an invasion of Iraq but not these countries ? now where have those ethics gone again..... [quote:0cadc]Moore has a “fact checker team” – hired by him of course – to check his “facts”. This is not an “opinion” piece. Moore is presenting this as “fact”. [/quote:0cadc] Then if what he is saying is true??? why are you argueing it ? seems you just shut yourself down. [quote:0cadc]No I lived through 10 years of “the ghetto” under a democrat and quite frankly didnt see much of the “liberals love education, minorities, and blah blah blah”. I did however see more than a few people close to me get shuffled on off to the afterlife and did see more than a few people get “disenfranchised” by government in general. This is in the most liberal state in the United States also – California. [/quote:0cadc] I lived for years under the Mulroney Conservative government in Canada, they put this nation into a deficit 42billion to be exact, and for a Country like Canada that hurts. I lived under Mike "The Knife" Harris in Onatrio for most of my older school career, what I saw was education cutbacks and the quality of life in general go from somewhat stable to shit. Welfare which at one point my mom was on was almost denied to her, The Hospital waits are unbareble because Provincial Conservatives were not willing o raise spending onHealthcare from federal cuts. There is a truckload of Conservative fuck ups here as well, point being or "whati m trying to say is, They don't always work out. SOme do some don't. To let you know I lived downtown Toronto for 7 years as a kid in declineing North York area. I know what a ghetto is and have experienced it, so lets not get into all of that, as for people passing away, I've seen many go by my ways as well. God Bless them. [quote:0cadc]Tell that to Saddam Hussein. [/quote:0cadc] Tell that to Bush. (but then again i'm only a trained ape...)