[Eight Ace]

[quote="Old Reliable":d95f5]tgb also ignores the fact that there is something else happening in the us - crime.
whats to be done about that? it seems that this country is slowly becoming more divided
(granted not to the point of vietnam proportions) but who knows if it could reach that.[/quote:d95f5]
I'm not sure what is meant here, America has crime but China doesn't...?
Americas crime has divided the US to vietnamese propotions?....look to china why..?
what's on your mind fella? eek:

[Mr.Buttocks]

Originally Posted by guarnere

FUCK YES!!!

TGB FOR PRES!

rock: rock:

Dude, you're a tit.

[Zen]

hmmmmm,

I was wondering when something like this would surface. I can certainly understand thier cause for alarm.

I typically don't bother with most of the crap in OT because of the often ridiculous replies and poor attitudes, but today...the day before the re-count, I suppose I'll take the time to type.

I have failed faith in Bush, I just don't like the discissions he has made. I think he is a man of good charicter, and I even voted for the guy last time around. But his actions and choices cause me to question his goals, plans, and purpose.

In my opinion, this country needs a total self-reexamination. We need to address countless issues with-in ourselves before we focus on the problems of the world outside our own borders.
From our outdated affirmative action policies to the core of our democratic structure, America is a corrupt, under-edjucated, bitter shell of what it once was. I don't blame Bush for that, but I do expect him or the next guy to do something about it.

A few things I don't understand:

Why is it ok to invade a country or enforce international law when countries develope WMD, when America has a massive arsinal of them now? Are we a "special case" in the world?

Why are we able to violate international law and invade and occupy a country without UN consent? We would never allow another country to do this!

As the "World Police", why are we more focused on N. Korea and Iran than countries like Sudan, where 30K people have been killed and over 1 Million forced from thier homes? The UN is acting...but we are not.

HomeFront:

After 9/11 imagration and border control managed to get off the back burner, but more has been done to ensure Americans don't bring box cutters on planes than actual "border" control... wtf?

Hybrid & Alternative fuel vehicles could virtually eliminate the US, and the worlds need and depedancy on fossil fuels, yet very little, or no insentive has been given to manufacturers to advance this technology. (A relection of world economics, but also a reflection of America's corrupt bottom line.)

Affirmative action laws, while important a decade ago, force companies to have a certain number of "minorities" within thier employees...by law. This means that should a company need to close a factory, or branch they would be required to maintain thier "minority" employees numbers regardless of skill or job qualifications. This is discriminatory because it means that a person who is labeled as a "minority" is prefered over a non-minority regardless of actual abillity to do a job!

I could go on, but I'm certain you guys see where I'm going with this. We must start to adapt to the new face of the world, or face dire consiquenses in the near future.

[Mr.Buttocks]

Originally Posted by Zen

I typically don't bother with most of the crap in OT because of the often ridiculous replies and poor attitudes, but today...the day before the re-count, I suppose I'll take the time to type.

We are truly blessed and honoured by your presence here, oh great one. oOo:

[Zen]

[quote="Mr.Buttocks":32a11]

Originally Posted by Zen

I typically don't bother with most of the crap in OT because of the often ridiculous replies and poor attitudes, but today...the day before the re-count, I suppose I'll take the time to type.

We are truly blessed and honoured by your presence here, oh great one. oOo:[/quote:32a11]

Pervert




happy:

[geRV]

[quote="Mr.Buttocks":0607b]

Originally Posted by Zen

I typically don't bother with most of the crap in OT because of the often ridiculous replies and poor attitudes, but today...the day before the re-count, I suppose I'll take the time to type.

We are truly blessed and honoured by your presence here, oh great one. oOo:[/quote:0607b]

dance:

[Zen]

In all seriousness, I'm not trying to sound pretentious.

OT consistantly has some of the most stupid thread topics I have ever seen. It's like VC with a dozen Sclasses around here if Brittney gets a new boyfriend.

[tomxtr]

I don't disagree with your take on the good 'ole US of A and I understand why the younger folks feel like the US is playing world police. I think this is happening because the UN has become increasingly less relevant in policing rogue governments. They seem unwilling to commit forces anywhere under any circumstances.

Take the Sudan for example, just today Sudanese troops have surrounded refugee camps and refused access to the UN aid workers. This is the same country where it was reported that 40,000+ women and children were reported raped by government backed militia men. What is the UN immediate response to this crisis? They plan to evacuate aid workers. It is estimated that by the end of the year the Sudanese governments self-described "reign of terror" will have claimed 500,000 lives. This complacency by the UN smell of Rwanda where the UN failed to act and the ethnic cleansing of the Tutsi people claimed over 800,000 lives.

Iraq is another example of where the UN failed. Everyone knows that the UN condemned the invasion of Kuwait by the Iraqis and imposed sanctions and restrictions. These, however, were routinely ignored by the previous regime. They consistently shot at aircraft patrolling the no fly zones, prohibited weapons inspectors from doing there jobs, continued to suppress the kurds in the north and the shiites in the south. The UN again did nothing.

That being said, I would prefer that the UN step up and take more of a leadership role instead of imposing meaningless sanctions. If they are not willing to do so, I don't see a problem with the US stepping in and helping people who are being systematically killed or raped as they are in rogue nations like Sudan.

[geRV]

http://edition.cnn.com/2004/TECH/space/ ... index.html

eek:

[TGB!]

The UN isnt become irrelevant so much as its becoming FAR too complacent and willing to pacify instead of moving forward.

Change often comes violently. France, The Americas, The Japanese, even China welcoming Mao - all violent change.

Nevermind the idiots taking bribes.

[Tripper]

I don't know much about American politics (Great way to stay afloat in this thread, I know oOo: )

But what I do have is a non-prejudice, non-canadian outside look in at the U.S, and I have to say, Iraq did feel like a big "Fuck you guys - You mean nothing to us" from the U.S to every country in the UN....

I'm wondering what would happen if Britian or another western world power did a similar thing. Probably nothing.

That would explain alot of ill feelings toward the U.S from alot of nations around the world. I'm not saying I disagree with what the U.S did, and I'm not saying I agree either. I'm staying outside of the political arena as much as I can here.

This is just what I see from the outside looking in.


Overall, the fucked up media coverage is to blame for this shit being such a fucking issue to everyone....

[Old Reliable]

<expert on UN

here's to clarify reasons for UN non-intervention. the USA created the UN. the UN depends on USA funding. headquarters for UN are in new york. how can you sanction the usa when it is on the security council with uk as an ally? currently there is speculation on adding possibly brasil, japan and or germany to the security council permeanent members. as for this having an impact on un intervention (stated in chapter 7 of UN charter) there isnt much taht can be done. however within the charter is a description of regional organizations allowed to take action (nato, cis) in regional affairs before the UN can send in peace keepers. the major lacking in UN muscle is its engagement rules (very weak).

so when you see a smurf you're not supposed to fire, because their engagement is limited, however a lot of smurfs die while in peacekeeping missions. take UNPROFOR's problem in serbia years ago. the conflict was not stable enough for UN troops, but they were sent in anyways. as a result, the peacekeeping force had to be removed. thankfully there are a number of states who still have faith in the UN, which prevents it from having the same demise as the league following invasion of ethopia and manchuria in early 1930s.

we can only hope that the usa has learned its lesson in disrupting ALL UN principles (they must be followed by all members). eventually the usa will call for UN assistance, only because the UN's influence is so vast, it is difficult to avoid. im not an expert on taiwan at all. (btw its not a member, due to 1 china policy) but i cannot see the UN involving itself with a chinese conflict....

[Old Reliable]

[quote="TGB!":b6bc2]The UN isnt become irrelevant so much as its becoming FAR too complacent and willing to pacify instead of moving forward.

Change often comes violently. France, The Americas, The Japanese, even China welcoming Mao - all violent change.

Nevermind the idiots taking bribes.[/quote:b6bc2]

this is the basis of the UN< world peace. chapter 7 stating UN force has only been used in korean conflict and 1st gulf war