Anti-Patriot: The Latest Fad - Page 10

TGB! · 07-07-2004, 04:14 PM

[quote:1355d]I believe it is called Senate legislation S 1637; I am not sure if it was passed or killed, but it did exist as a plan at some point and Bush supported it, don't pretend like it didn't exist.[/quote:1355d]

Oh please. Just because it had the endoresement of the President doesnt mean itll survive out of committee. As his partys head, of COURSE hes going to support leglislation that tows party line, and keeps special interest happy. Doesnt mean hes sitting in the oval office hoping to god the bill gets passed, and in fact no doubt is certain it would get killed.

KTOG · 07-07-2004, 04:45 PM

[quote="Short Hand":cf4d6][quote="Sgt Stryker":cf4d6][quote=Noctis][quote=KTOG]Short Hand take some college level Macroeconomics classes then come back with material. All those ideas you brought up were opinion and not fact.[/quote]

^^^^^^^^

And for further reference, it was made possible for those corporations to pack up and leave by none other than - [insert gasp here] - the Democrats who pushed NAFTA through during the Clinton Administration. NAFTA, along with a few smaller trade agreements, are considered the most irresponsible in the history of the US. Clinton's trade policies sent corporations fleeing happily to Mexico with no penalty, and have us sitting in a $100 billion trade defecit with China. And all thanks to Liberals. Republicans tried to stop the bills.

Now shut the fuck up until you have some education.[/quote]

then why is Bush now pushing a bill to give tax breaks for companies who outsource? If your opposed to outsourcing then you cfix the problem when you get in power, not make the problem worse!
YOU need to check YOUR facts before you break into your regular "democrats this, democracts that" rhetoric.[/quote:cf4d6]

so im not alone ? rock:[/quote:cf4d6]

Out sourcing is definatly not a totally bad thing. You can compare this to when our army goes out to protect or defend freedom in other countries. Not everyone agrees with it but it must happen. With outsousorcing many jobs are created for poor/undeveloped countries. Yes, the pay is not great and yes the jobs are usually shitty. Do you know what that person would be doing if that job wasn't there? Probably shoveling shit for even less money than they get for sewing soccer balls. You might hear how bad the pay is but the only other stable job in these countries is farming. It gives them a chance to help out in the global economy. These people in the foreign countries were not forced to take this job, they chose to because it was a better oppurtunity than the one they had.

As for better jobs that are outsourced to European countries like England, France, Germany, ETC. are also a must. Existing companies ask themselves a question of "Should we open up a new market or open another factory in an already diluted market?" Many of these European divisions have been untapped. These outsourced jobs still pay the US, in doing so helps out our economy. With out these jobs companies would not be worth what they were and could not produce in America as efficiently if these jobs were not available. Why open a plant in America when you know its just going to close because it is not needed? Thats just bad business.

From a Macroeconomical viewpoint, the reasoning for outsourcing being bad that i'm getting from you 2 is the lack of jobs.

[url="http://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.toc.htm"]http://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.toc.htm[/url]

The standard gauge for unemployment is defined at 5.6 % in America. However this doesn't include people not of age and people that haven't been searching for a job in 3 months. Therefor the actually unemployment rate is probably in the 9-10% range. THIS IS NOT A PROBLEM. These people are either people that are well off, lazy, house wives(husbands), or have some other reasoning for not taking a job. As for the 5.6 percent, about 4% find jobs within 6 months. So that leaves us with 1.6 percent ... wow, that isn't a big number. These people will either be integrated into the people who give up looking or will take a longer time to find a job. If you believe its possible to have 100% in the US i don't know what your smoking but i want it.

In both micro and macroeconomic theory outsourcing is good for the US and World econmy.

Damn i should save this post for an essay at school

MrLevinstein · 07-07-2004, 05:03 PM

[quote="Sgt Stryker":a2b0b]Lev. the ability to childishly cuss someone out does not show anyone here (well anyone intelligent) that you've won the argument; rather the opposite is true.[/quote:a2b0b]

Stryk, that wasnt very childish or very cuss filled. Youre ability to come into the arguement 9 pages later with nothing but bullshit opinions doesnt show anyone here (well anyone intellegence) that youve won the arguement:rather the opposite is true.

I was just telling the kid to sit down and stfu because he is wrong, most people when wrong admit it and STFU, but short hands muscles are far bigger than his brain.

07-07-2004, 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrLevinstein

Stryk, that wasnt very childish or very cuss filled.

it looked rather childish to me

[quote:fa0f0]Youre ability to come into the arguement 9 pages later [/quote:fa0f0]
excuse me for having a life and not responding to these threads every hour like some of these people oOo:

[quote:fa0f0]with nothing but bullshit opinions doesnt show anyone here (well anyone intellegence) that youve won the arguement:rather the opposite is true.[/quote:fa0f0]
the fact that Bush also supported a bill that would lead to more outsourcing is not a "bullshit opinion" neither is the fact that Noctis is wrong when he blames Clinton for all our problems

Also, it's anyone intelligent or anyone of intelligence; not anyone intelligence

[quote:fa0f0]I was just telling the kid to sit down and stfu because he is wrong, most people when wrong admit it and STFU, but short hands muscles are far bigger than his brain.[/quote:fa0f0]

that's your "bullshit opinion", why can't he be wrong when folks from the right side of the spectrum are also often wrong and don't shut up?

07-07-2004, 07:24 PM

[quote="TGB!":437d2][quote:437d2]I believe it is called Senate legislation S 1637; I am not sure if it was passed or killed, but it did exist as a plan at some point and Bush supported it, don't pretend like it didn't exist.[/quote:437d2]

Oh please. Just because it had the endoresement of the President doesnt mean itll survive out of committee. As his partys head, of COURSE hes going to support leglislation that tows party line, and keeps special interest happy. Doesnt mean hes sitting in the oval office hoping to god the bill gets passed, and in fact no doubt is certain it would get killed.[/quote:437d2]

I never said it would be passed (God I sure hope it won't be), I'm just reminding Noctis that Clinton is not the only president who supported stupid ideas. I'm big enough to admit that both parties make stupid decisions, is the rest of aa.com big enough?

Pyro · 07-07-2004, 07:32 PM

[quote="Sgt Stryker":438e7][quote="TGB!":438e7][quote:438e7]I believe it is called Senate legislation S 1637; I am not sure if it was passed or killed, but it did exist as a plan at some point and Bush supported it, don't pretend like it didn't exist.[/quote:438e7]

Oh please. Just because it had the endoresement of the President doesnt mean itll survive out of committee. As his partys head, of COURSE hes going to support leglislation that tows party line, and keeps special interest happy. Doesnt mean hes sitting in the oval office hoping to god the bill gets passed, and in fact no doubt is certain it would get killed.[/quote:438e7]

I never said it would be passed (God I sure hope it won't be), I'm just reminding Noctis that Clinton is not the only president who supported stupid ideas. I'm big enough to admit that both parties make stupid decisions, is the rest of aa.com big enough?[/quote:438e7]

If people didn't know...Michael Moore wrote in one of his books against basic things of both big parties, not just the conservative one. Moore is right...he dones't like Kerry, but getting Bush out is the ultimate thing. Who would like Kerry...? He is no Clinton...but he is not Bush which is better than having Bush.

Drew · 07-07-2004, 07:39 PM

Well.. since KTOG beat me to the punch.. again..

I'll just reiterate that outsourcing is not a entirely bad thing. It is bad when it is unregulated, such as the case with NAFTA. The bill which you reference, if I recall correctly (I can't seem to find it in the Senate database - did it even make it that far?), would give tax benefits to corporations who outsourced work to specific countries and under very strict guidelines which revolved around what my professors referred to as the "Samaritan Effect," wherein a company establishes a solid reputation in an unpenetrated market by providing jobs to the community and then moves to begin providing its product and/or service in said market, thus generating TAXABLE income for the US-based corporation, which also pays tariffs and import taxes on its goods (this break is not applicable for people who outsource to say, Mexico, because there are no import taxes or tariffs thanks to NAFTA).

Furthermore, outsourcing has almost NOTHING to do with a trade defecit with China. The problem is that the Clinton Administration enacted a trade agreement with China that practically lifted all restrictions on imports, while China to this day maintains heavy restrictions on our exports, which are literally BANNED in most parts of the country. And a $100 billion trade defecit isn't enough to break the back of the economy, but when that catches up (just in time for Clinton to step out of office), it sure as shit can be enough to nuke a surplus that was what, $82 billion? Not to mention the tech crash and the dot com crash and the NAFTA backlash.

I don't think I've ever met a Liberal that was well-versed in Economics, seriously. Anyone who is knows that Capitalism is the way to be rock:

KTOG · 07-08-2004, 05:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Noctis

I don't think I've ever met a Liberal that was well-versed in Economics, seriously. Anyone who is knows that Capitalism is the way to be rock:

I'm fairly liberal however I never heard any liberal politicians speak well about our current Economic status. Alan Greenspan is my hero and all you nay sayers can get on your knees a blow him because he knows what he is doing. This man has been in office for longer than you have been on the earth so i wouldn't criticize this man's policies. dance: dance: dance:

Short Hand · 07-08-2004, 05:46 AM

[img]http://maritimes.indymedia.org/local/webcast/uploads/metafiles/sweatshop.jpg[/img]

foreign exploitation. There is no excuse for it.

[img]http://www.uniteunion.org/sweatshops/photos/picture7.jpg[/img]

its all about money and more of it. no one seems to care, then you go and give comapnies an excuse saying they had to. my god. 10 cents a day for these people. Im talking about social justice here.

Our lives shall not be sweated from birth until life closes;
Hearts starve as well as bodies; give us bread but give us roses!"----from the labor song 'Bread and Roses' by James Oppenheim .

[quote:b5524]Out sourcing is definatly not a totally bad thing. You can compare this to when our army goes out to protect or defend freedom in other countries. Not everyone agrees with it but it must happen. With outsousorcing many jobs are created for poor/undeveloped countries. Yes, the pay is not great and yes the jobs are usually shitty. Do you know what that person would be doing if that job wasn't there? Probably shoveling shit for even less money than they get for sewing soccer balls. You might hear how bad the pay is but the only other stable job in these countries is farming. It gives them a chance to help out in the global economy. These people in the foreign countries were not forced to take this job, they chose to because it was a better oppurtunity than the one they had[/quote:b5524]

so getting a 12 year old kid to make your nikes is a good thing ? & these companies should be paying the workers a livable wage not 10 cents a day. Its not a hard concept, considering they charge 40 bucks a a t shirt. thats alot of profit if you ask me. why not just pay them better ? its possible yet not being done.

Short Hand · 07-08-2004, 05:48 AM

[quote=Tripper]

Quote:

Originally Posted by "Short Hand":8d370

[quote:8d370]opinion and not fact.

sweat shops don't exist ? All I ask is corporations change their ethics, I don't see how this is stupid. I didn't know giving livable wages to poor people was stupid. Thats all i nearly suggested. I don't have the "economic knowledge that noctis has" (Hell im going to university to study graphic design..) So im not some bain child of it all like yourself. rolleyes:
[/quote:8d370]

The question is.....WHY? Why here? How is some stupid little nerd on a stupid little gaming forum for a stupid little outdated game going to make a difference? All you're doing here is being an annoying fuckwit, nobody is taking you seriously, and even if they were, do you think they're gonna be like "OMG! He's RIGHT! LETS GO BOMB THE CORPORATIONS!"

Fuck no.

Why waste your time and sacrifice respect, among other things, just to try and make some point that isn't even relevant on this forum, and is not going to help your cause in the slightest??

I think, along with most of the people around here, that you're just being an attention whore because you seek attention like oxygen....You're like a 5 year old. "MOMMY MOMMY LOOK AT ME!"[/quote:8d370]

why go to a place saturated with politics, This seems more of the place, and if you had not noticed this place ain't much of a gaming forum anymore.

KTOG · 07-08-2004, 06:15 AM

[quote="Short Hand":f774f]
so getting a 12 year old kid to make your nikes is a good thing ? & these companies should be paying the workers a livable wage not 10 cents a day. Its not a hard concept, considering they charge 40 bucks a a t shirt. thats alot of profit if you ask me. why not just pay them better ? its possible yet not being done.[/quote:f774f]

I told you it wasn't all fun and games. These children would be starving or not a have any form of income in the first place. They would be farming or doing some sort of other job. They saw these jobs as more fit for them than anything that was available. They weren't forced by police or the government to work their, they were forced by their countries poor economy and their need to survive.