[Ydiss]

[quote="CaP bUsTa":d013a] Our lifes are a minute fraction of time in an unimaginably small part of the universe, but it's my fraction of time. Im going to do something with it.[/quote:d013a]

Amen.

biggrin:

As for believing science or religion... I'm much more inclined to believe science.

If it were not for science then we'd still be living in caves rubbing sticks together.

Science has provided more good and beneficial things than religion ever has.

Certainly, science has also produced many bad things and, because of it, we are slowly killing our planet.

But if you look at how science has enabled humans and animals to live longer, curing diseases, and so on, then compare it to what religion has brought us over 2000+ years...

Religion breeds dispute, hatred, killing, murder just as much as it provides inner peace.

Sure, it's nice to think a lost familly member is going to a nice place, but I'd much rather have them still alive because of an amazing scientific break-though and I'd much rather a world without all the religious conflict.

God supposedly gives us life then takes it away at will. We are supposed to accept that, but we aren't we are trying to stop it through science. God must be pretty upset at that, then I suppose?

God has supposedly made us flawed because of the mistakes made by one couple at the creation of man. Only when we all act in his name will be again become immortal and live in paradise. Gee thanks.

So, let me get this straight... God gave us mortality and disease, death and pain. Science tries its best to take that away.

Which do I prefer? Hmm, tough one that. I think I'm more inclined to believe that we die due to the way genetical reproduction is finite, we feel pain because it is an in-built warning system and there is disease because we are not the only organisms on the planet and not all are benevolent.

The worst part of religion is the contradiction.

Not in the facts, as there are no facts in religion.

The contradiction comes from the behaviours of the religious people. Surely a pure-of-heart group of people who are at peace would not feel the need to convert others to a cause that they do not believe in.

Either by wheedling, bible-pushing, or in extreme circumstances, by force (sometimes with deadly force).

And, to a degree, Innoxx is right. Following religion is like following a shepherd.

Do we all not have our own will, our own wishes and our own lives?

Believe in what you want to, not what you are told to.

Religion was created when humans were very unevolved and very rustic. It was created when we were ignorant of many forces and realities.

Since we have learnt more and more about how we are, what we are made of and how we work, religious people still believe that we and every single atom on this planet (and I suppose the whole universe) were created by one immortal man that no one has ever seen. A man with a beard and who wears robes and lives on another plane.

Oh come on...

[pest]

Why does science always have to be the antithesis of religion? Its not.

The church is corrupt because it is run by humans. That doesnt make religion bad. Wars would have happened just as surely with out religion. Its mans nature. Religion was just the excuse.

[Ydiss]

Originally Posted by pest

Why does science always have to be the antithesis of religion? Its not.

The church is corrupt because it is run by humans. That doesnt make religion bad. Wars would have happened just as surely with out religion. Its mans nature. Religion was just the excuse.

I would agree totally.

However, science does a lot to disprove a lot of aspects of religion and many religious people dislike that.

[pest]

Originally Posted by Ydiss

However, science does a lot to disprove a lot of aspects of religion and many religious people dislike that.

Examples?

[Tiwaz]

Originally Posted by Ydiss

Religion was created when humans were very unevolved and very rustic. It was created when we were ignorant of many forces and realities.

We are still ignorant of many forces and realities. Thinking we are not is being naïve. Wo do not know all. I personally believe we're not even close. I also believe the human mind is capable of so much more than we know of at this time. We will evolve further. Too bad I will not be around the next 100,000,000 years. Maybe we (mankind) will not even survive that long.

Originally Posted by Ydiss

Since we have learnt more and more about how we are, what we are made of and how we work, religious people still believe that we and every single atom on this planet (and I suppose the whole universe) were created by one immortal man that no one has ever seen. A man with a beard and who wears robes and lives on another plane.

Oh come on...

Why generalize religion? Surely you are being sarcastic about the robe and beard, that's what they tell children.


And like I said before, many words are very relative to man. The 'universe' for example. The definition of universe is everything. Things, places that are not discovered yet are not part of that universe. According to science, God might not exist. Thus not part of the universe. Science also says: The universe has an edge. We don't know what happens on the edge. Only thing we know is that it is expanding at the edge. It expands into the 'thing' that not exists yet. And becomes part of the universe. Nothing turns into part of the everything. Does that mean the nothing did not exist until then? But if didn't exist, how could it become something?

Things like this are the reason for the existence of religion. A zillion years ago it was because we did not understand what a thunderstorm was all about (and even nowadays we can not completely comprehend and predict the nature of a thunderstorm), at this moment it is because we do not understand the universe. What's next? We don't even understand eachother.

And, okay then, we're back to the basis of religion: Faith. Whether you like it or not: Everybody is a believer. Either you believe in a God/higher being/etc. or you don't believe. A disbeliever? No. You're not sure are you? So you are a believer too. You believe there's nothing there. Believe because you can not be sure.

For me personally, I like a mix. I tend to be more scientific than religious. But there is also a place for religion in my life. But it is my own personal religion. I don't need a church to tell me what is wrong or right. Like pest said, the church is corrupt. Because of the humans who run it.

[Vance]

I will not argue with you Atheists or whatever you are that doesn't beileve in God, because it is no use. Nor, you should not argue with me because it wil not change my mindset of there is a God and a Christ and I will go to Heaven when I die.

I pity the non-beileves of this board because they miss the major things that Christianity has changed (ever heard of A.D and B.C?). Pretty much all of the places where major events occur in the bible can be found as historical monuments today. Care to find me another religion that has a Bible or something like it and name a place that is a historical monument?

Now the non-beilevers will come back with ''Oh yeah, someone could of just made up all the stories and put them where they wanted to'' well isn't that pretty simplistic of YOU guys? Let's face it; Atheism is the most simplistic religion (If you can call it a religion) and the non-beilevers are the most simplistic of all. You see, the non-beilever/Atheist group goes like this: You are born, your life is crap, you die. The end. WOAH! That's REALLY COMPLICATED!

Christianity goes like: Your Father in Heaven creates you, your life isn't all that bad, you die, you meet Peter, are you good or bad? Go to Heaven, get to see God, spend eternity with him, live an eternity of peace, or, go to Hell, live an eternity of torture and fire. (I know alot of people here that will go into that second category)

I bet you could take two people, Athiest and a Christian, both in weelchairs and both have some kind of disability. You ask wich of the two is a happier person, and I'll bet it's the Christian over the Athiest anyday. Because the Christian knows where he is going after death. And that soothes him. The Athiest is scared and has NO hope because he knows when his life is over, it's over. Done.


(And please don't stereotype us as crazy extremists that drink Sarin and dance to hillbilly music, I hate that. Actually, don't stereotype us at all. Thanks.)

[gtboys34]

[quote="Vance1"]
Go to Heaven, get to see God, spend eternity with him, live an eternity of peace, or, go to Hell, live an eternity of torture and fire. (I know alot of people here that will go into that second category)

hey man, u should say that "u know ppl here who are going to hell" b/c u dont. Every person here @ the forums, in the world, have a "chance" to change their lives, but of course thats up to them to decide if they want to or not. So to say that their going to hell is just plain wrong. Hence the term "Saved"

[gtboys34]

shouldn't*

[Duke_of_Ray]

[quote:43c6b]Spare me your bible thumping rhetoric. Religion = in my opinion and nothing you say or do is gonna change that.
[/quote:43c6b]

By doing my "biblethumping", I am trying to show you a way to be spared from enternity in Hell. I can not save you, you can not save yourself, nobody but Jesus can save you. Why not just reda the Bible? Just read it, just see if it makes sense, are you afarid to read it? Doi not be afraid, God wanst us to accept Him, for your own sake believe.

As for Capbusta, it is really sad that you have pushed God away, but remeber God loves you and He will always forgive you if you dicide to come back.

[[DAS REICH] Blitz]

gtboys thats teh coollest sig ive ever seen

[gtboys34]

[quote="[DAS REICH] Blitz":898fc]gtboys thats teh coollest sig ive ever seen[/quote:898fc] yeah man, im new to the sig making crap, my next 1 is gonna be phat. Im gonna start on it 2night

[Vance]

Duke, don't ask them to read the bible, because 99% percent of the time they won't get what the crap is going on. The bible is a very complicated thing.

[Vance]

Originally Posted by gtboys34

Yes, but the road they are on now at this moment idicates a road to Hell. Yes, they can be saved, but as of right now, if they die, they will go to Hell.

[Tiwaz]

Originally Posted by Vance1

Yes, but the road they are on now at this moment idicates a road to Hell. Yes, they can be saved, but as of right now, if they die, they will go to Hell.

Are you one of God's henchmen? You know who goes to hell? No. That's what I hate about the church as well. Say 100 'Hail Maries' and you're saved. Easy eh?

I don't believe it works that way. I believe (believe because I am not sure) that if God exists, he will not punish a non-believer that has lived a good life by sending him or her to hell.

I bet you are most likely one of them Christians who actually thinks he is better off and a better person because he is such a firm believer (wow, you pity atheists, very good). Go to church every Sunday, pray a lot and stuff. I have news for you. Thinking you are better than another human being is a sin. We are all equally of value. If you are not such a person, consider this to be a message for people who are. Because I have seen so many Christians who think they are better than the non-believer. It is those people who are most likely to use religion as an excuse for war. Win some souls for God. Because they think they are so right.

[Argon]

For an in depth discussion about this read this link from the Captain Obvious forum.

http://www.captain-obvious.com/forums/s ... readid=593