[c312]

15,000 of them?


I'm sure we should do something to take better care of the planet, but I do not think it is as imminent as a threat that most people are pushing it to be. It is not an issue that is clear cut, many scientists are divided on global warming and I don't think it something that will create any serious effects anytime soon. I think many people are overreacting to what Gore and "The Day After Tomorrow" are presenting and taking it to heart without considering it. I'm just saying, I don't think it's as big of a deal as everyone is making it out to be, I don't beleive that it is something proving to be an imminent threat to the world, and I don't beleive that we need to take actions like the Kyoto agreement to make things harder on the people on the earth unnecessarily.

That said, I think we should take steps to reduce pollution, I just don't think we need to be so extreme about it.

[Jimmy Paterson]

it will happen, and then there will be an ice age, and no im not saying that cause of that moive.

[mR.cLeAn]

[quote="Jimmy Paterson":8103e]it will happen, and then there will be an ice age, and no im not saying that cause of that moive.[/quote:8103e]

What movie, was it good?

We should start outsorcing our waste to mars, its allready f-ed up, or just send it straight to the sun and it would help the sun so it doesn't die in a couple hundred years.

And yeah is just a theory. Sadly we will only see it as just a theory cause nature is unpredictable, and there are too many constants, and what not, so we cannot get an accurate thing going since it will take hundreds of years.

I'm all for nature, but mother nature can be somewhat rough sometimes ... hurricanes. And is not like hurricanes started happening this millenium, and at this strength.

[Stammer]

[quote="mR.cLeAn":35f32]We should start outsorcing our waste to mars, its allready f-ed up,[/quote:35f32]

oOo:

[quote="mR.cLeAn":35f32]or just send it straight to the sun and it would help the sun so it doesn't die in a couple hundred years.[/quote:35f32]

No, it wont help at all. Plus try a few billion years.

[mR.cLeAn]

My bad, my sources told me the wrong information.

[Bleuachdu]

Originally Posted by elstatec

sorry where did you get this bullshit from? And just because the pollution hasnt affected temperatures in the US doesnt mean US's pollution hasnt affected the worlds temperatures or atmosphere.

Now something more realistic:

[img]http://img348.imageshack.us/img348/4329/instrumentaltemperaturerecord6.png[/img]
"This image shows the instrumental record of global average temperatures as compiled by the Climatic Research Unit of the University of East Anglia and the Hadley Centre of the UK Meteorological Office. Data set TaveGL2v was used. The most recent documentation for this data set is Jones, P.D. and Moberg, A. (2003) "Hemispheric and large-scale surface air temperature variations: An extensive revision and an update to 2001". Journal of Climate, 16, 206-223."




I cant believe how ignorant some of you are on this, it is just stupid that you stand so firm behind such a idiotic leader's every decision, such a wrong one on not ratifying the Kyoto Treaty.

Is it just me, or does that graph basically confirm what Tom said? If you read the data points, the variance at its highest and lowest point is roughly between 0.9-1.1 degrees C change.

Regarding the issue at hand; I do think global warming exists and something needs to be done about it. I live in the heart of Detroit, where automotive companies rule the land. I can tell you that they're busting their asses off to identify and engineer alternative energy sources. In fact, a new corporation just built a huge research facility a few blocks from me that is strictly reserved for alternative energy exploration. A buddy of mine that works at Ford was telling me that Toyota is working on a hybrid that will get between 70-100 MPG. I read an article that said something along the same lines ([url=http://www.business2.com/b2/web/articles/0,17863,1107812,00.html:aee19]article[/url:aee19]).

The beauty of a market driven economy is the huge incentive for such comapnies to find a sustainable & renewable alternative energy source. You think the oil companies make a lot of $? Wait until one of these companies finds a solution to the fossil fuel problem; they'll make more than any of us could even imagine.

[c312]

Exactly. People always say that the big oil companies are only focused on selling oil until it runs out. Does that make any sense? Why would a billion dollar industry want to do something so destructive to itself? The incentive of alternate energy sources is too great for them to ignore, and that's why many of them are investing in r&d of alternative sources of energy, because it's an easy business choice.

[newt.]

We get alot of current events reports about Global Warming. And yes human pollution of the atomsphere is a growing concern but really I don't care. I don't mean to sound ignorant or selfish or shortminded but I think people should worry more about education then ice caps. I don't mean to sound stupid, saying that, but lets get our children educated and movetivated. Fit as much life as we can in the brief moment that humans have existed on earth.

[Short Hand]

You claim Kyoto is nonsense because it is only there to stop Global Warming.. Bullshit. It was made up in order to deal with massive smog problems, maybe you do not live by a major smog center, but it effects your health and FUCKING LIFE EXPECTANCY !!!!. This is just as important as a fucking hole in the atmosphere, We need to stop polluting. Remember.. You breathe it in.

[c312]

I live in Northern Virginia, a very densely populated area. And while you argue that we should do something about smog, I think the rest of the world needs to do something. In Indonesia and China they have had bad enough air pollution that they had to wear surgical masks around outside. I think America and Europeans countries have been much better at limiting emmissions than the rest of the world. Getting angry at America for not signing it is stupid, we should just make sure the really bad countries sign it. Our smog isn't that bad, maybe NY and LA are really bad but we are already making new gas to lower emmissions and raising emmission standards. (That's why gas is more expensive in CA, because they use special formulations to limit emmissions) I just don't think the world should be mad at us when it's Asia and South America who are doing the most damage.

[Sgt>Stackem]

[quote="Short Hand":c367e]You claim Kyoto is nonsense because it is only there to stop Global Warming.. Bullshit. It was made up in order to deal with massive smog problems, maybe you do not live by a major smog center, but it effects your health and FUCKING LIFE EXPECTANCY !!!!. This is just as important as a fucking hole in the atmosphere, We need to stop polluting. Remember.. You breathe it in.[/quote:c367e]


as you say "FUCKING LIFE EXPECTANCY" has done nothing but rise since forever

[newt.]

some major countries that contribute huge amounts of pollution are exempt from kyoto

[elstatec]

Originally Posted by Bleuachdu

Is it just me, or does that graph basically confirm what Tom said? If you read the data points, the variance at its highest and lowest point is roughly between 0.9-1.1 degrees C change.

sorry do you not see the line gradiant of the graph rising? yes the temperatures may be shown to be over the play with the blue dots but as you see they are rising and not coming down if you notice the incline upto 2000. You may say well yes its only 0.9-1.1 degrees blah blah, but it only takes the mildest of changes to effect the earth, the polar ice caps are melting, maybe they are going very very slowly but they are and in the future as the temperature increases to 1.1-###### the changes will be very visible.

[c312]

yeah, but that's only 140 years. There are graphs that show temperatures from much longer back that show a repeated increase and decrease in temperatures over decades

[Nyck]

JFC you guys are still arguing over this a month later.

Read State of Fear by michael crichton It is exactly about this and how environmentalists are overblowing it all.