[Himmler]

Hey if u need any help testing i shall put it up on our server and we can test it if youd like. Just give it to me on AIM or something...name is snwboarddude420

[Bazooka_Joe]

Originally Posted by Sclass12

no matter how good the map is, no one will play it. No one plays custom maps hake:

You must still be playing AI in Single player, son.

[doomsday2002]

Originally Posted by Sclass12

no matter how good the map is, no one will play it. No one plays custom maps hake:

That just is not true, this map looks fantastic and I would certainly play it.
The reason not many custom maps are played is because of prohibitive fps due to a not well designed map.
My computer is at the lower end and untill I get a new one I would be more than happy to wait longer for a well made playable map than something rushed with 15 fps.
I wish you every luck ydiss and ill follow this topic closely.

dooms.

[Ydiss]

Yes!

I'm a bloody genious biggrin:

I was about to give up last night. I had been working on trying to sort out the problems with my map damned hard these past 3 days and had gotten nowhere.

No matter what I did the map took ages to compile and even when I divided the map up into 4 sectors (with brutally crude walls, just to test) the map ran really badly with full vis.

I had deleted windows, shortened buildings, added dozens of walls in key places in order to block vis but still keep the map as close to the original as I could and still nothing worked.

Then, just as I was about to go to bed last night I decided to just add a few last ditch re-designs and set it to compile over night and into today. I was even thinking how to redesign the whole map!

I fully expected it to take all day today and I just got up and checked the compile to see it has finished!

This was less than 5 hours (not sure how fast it actually was, I'll try it later on tonight - even if it's 5 hours that's still bearable).

So, I started the map up.

Runs like a fucking dream!

On my machine (athlon XP 2000 - 512DDR ram and 64 MB gforce3) the lowest the FPS goes is 30-40 (and that's only in 2-3 spots - I will still endevour to work on the VIS to remove them). Never lower. Most of the time it runs over 80 FPS. That's as good as stock maps run for me biggrin: We'll see how well I've actually done in testing though.

I feel like I've just solved a bloody mystery.

There are a few negatives to the alterations. The map is slightly more closed off in places (notably the library area. That area was causing the most problems after my deductions so I had to surround it with a hefty wall - ';ll try my best to trim it down as much as I can though).

This means that the map isn't quite the snipers map as it may well have been, but there are still lots of long funnels to snipe in. In fact, the map might be a little more balanced for the changes.

I'll post more pics tonight to show the alterations.

A lot of them are just me having to think very very carefully about LOS and how VIS works. I've had to do a lot of research this week.

So, I'll start working on the lighting, clean up the alterations (a lot of them are very basic, I just wanted to get the problem solved) and I'll get right on to releasing a test version by the end of the week.

Phew biggrin: I was worried there for a bit.

[Magg0t]

Looks and sounds great, u really know wot ur doin , I think the community cud do with another OBJ map as there r only 3 of them at the mo (Bridge/hunt and v2) gud luck in the rest of the project.

Oh, and wot was the map going 2 be called?

[Zoner]

Originally Posted by Ydiss

This means that the map isn't quite the snipers map as it may well have been

Good!! biggrin:

Glad you got that snafu figured out Ydiss and good luck the rest of the way.

...and Magg0t, you haven't looked hard enough for obj maps. I personally played at least 6 brand new obj maps on AAN.net's server last night. Spearhead, mind you...

[Ydiss]

Thanks guys.

I'll make a quick "Blow up the target" obj version once the TDM/DM/RB version is completed and released.

I'll design it along these lines:

Allies have just taken control of the town and are preparing to deploy reinforcements when an Axis patrol happens upon the area. They have to retaliate by sabotaging two tanks/supply trucks (or whatever). This would allow them to regain control of the town.

Allies spawn on the North side, Axis on the South. The bomb targets would be located under the bridge and by the park (next to the pub).

If I had the inclination to and the skill at scripting I'd have replaced this with a more fun objective whereby all the players must rush to the pub and drink as much as they can before closing time and then beat the crap out of eachother outside. Last one standing wins. Pity this isn't entirely possible. Damn you EA!

What to call the map? Good question. "Crossfire: Part Deux" is a tongue-in-cheek working-title, but I don't think that'll do.

It's not based on a real location so I wouldn't like to name it after a European town of the war.

I was thinking "Crossfire Village" (TDM/DM/RB) and "Crossfire Village: Retaliation" (Objective).

Sound ok?

[Zoner]

"Crossfire Village" sounds great!

Yeah, too bad you can't do that pub/drinking contest idea. I have a feeling I'd be pretty good at that...heh heh

[wintersforge]

Hey thats great new Ydiss. Thanks for taking the time and walking us through from cradle to grave. I enjoyed the step by step and we over at aM are excited to put it through the paces. Maybe close the server down and invite a few aa.com n00bs over as well...Cant wait!!!

[Zoner]

Don't forget us aan.net n00bs! biggrin:

[wintersforge]

Originally Posted by Zoner91

Don't forget us aan.net n00bs! biggrin:

aM>AAN cool:

[Zoner]

heh heh

wintersforge > Zoner91

[Ydiss]

Oy, no derailing you two biggrin:

[Zoner]

Sorry. biggrin:

</thread hijack>

[Ydiss]

Here are some pics of a few alterations I had to use to improve the performance. This doesn't show the dozens of minor brush changes and repositionings but it shows how the performance is and how the structures are now.

First up, 4 shots from the centre of the map, the bridge. In the bottom right corner of all these pics is an overview with the POV highlighted in green.

Note that I have also included the FPS counter in the bottom left.

http://www.btinternet.com/~ydisss/Debug/Image2.jpg

http://www.btinternet.com/~ydisss/Debug/Image3.jpg

http://www.btinternet.com/~ydisss/Debug/Image4.jpg

http://www.btinternet.com/~ydisss/Debug/Image5.jpg

Opposite ends of the bridge:

http://www.btinternet.com/~ydisss/Debug/Image6.jpg

http://www.btinternet.com/~ydisss/Debug/Image7.jpg

Next up is a view of the Library with the new walls surrounding it. Note the FPS is 30 here, as low as it gets on my machine. This will dip below 20 on lower end machines but it's pretty much isolated to this particular area (more on that later).

http://www.btinternet.com/~ydisss/Debug/Image8.jpg

This pic shows the higher walls much clearer and a nice 70+ FPS to go with it:

http://www.btinternet.com/~ydisss/Debug/Image9.jpg

The above image is mostly down to the interior of the Library being dedesigned to enable better vising (so the inside of the library is only drawn for players inside it, for whom none of the outside will be drawn). The higher walls were included in an effort to section this area of the map from the rest of it. I may be able to reduce these walls a little (I'll test this tonight).

http://www.btinternet.com/~ydisss/Debug/Image10.jpg

Other side of the library.

http://www.btinternet.com/~ydisss/Debug/Image11.jpg

The above shot suffered low FPS before this revamp, even when fully compiled. Now it runs at a decent 45 FPS. Again, I am showing you worst case scanarios in these long shots.

http://www.btinternet.com/~ydisss/Debug/Image13.jpg

Above is an example of a best case scanario... This area was horribly slow before I revamped it. Now it runs over 80 FPS. The whole garden runs much smoother now thanks to 2 simple walls (seen middle shot). Before, you could see clear to the car park (South West corner of map).

http://www.btinternet.com/~ydisss/Debug/Image14.jpg

This is the old wine room. Removed the wine casks (Static models cause horrid FPS lag - I decided a while ago to not use many models in this map - They may look good but I prefer a playable map to a model-clogged one). The crucial part of this room is the 2 wall partitions (right and left). From this angle they conceal the door and window. If you look on the bottom right at the over-view you can see this room is quite centrally located. Effectively it failed to prevent Line Of Sight (LOS) from all angles around it. These two walls shut off a lot of that LOS. This rooms runs uber fast now, except when you go to the window (where it still runs well).

http://www.btinternet.com/~ydisss/Debug/Image15.jpg

I'm not 100% sure this addition makes a lot of difference (The next shot shows why). I may remove it. Effectively I wanted to block LOS from the Park to the Town Hall but I don't think it does that. What it does do though is block LOS from the North edge of the map to the South.

Reason I added this is because below and behind the camera is a door and middle shot behind the wall is a window. You can't see the window. That's what the wall's supposed to do biggrin: It works. This room is uber fast, now.

http://www.btinternet.com/~ydisss/Debug/Image16.jpg

This pic is a case of where VIS isn't working too well still. The problem here is, although I've effectively blocked LOS through the Pub and Restaurant (last pic) from here to the Town hall, this show clearly shows LOS to the Town Hall. Sadly this means this area will be laggy for most players (as I mentioned above, in the pic taken from this spot looking at the Library).

This is actually the worst spot in the whole map. I could break it up some and add some walls and increase FPS somewhat. I'd probably have to cut out the road on both sides of thr Pub.

I may do this as a test. With a little artistic hacking of structures I could still make this area flow gameplay-wise.

It'll reduce sniping a lot, though.

Last pic:

http://www.btinternet.com/~ydisss/Debug/Image17.jpg

An example of what I did to acheive this result. No more windows. I will add detailed windows to make it look more like a town hall but they won't be windows you can stand at and shoot through.

Before the revamp this front face had tons of LOS leaks in it. This allows you to see all the way into the gardens to the rear and caused bad performance (and also linked all the portals -- areas of VIS data -- so the compiling process took ages). Now, this front face is one solid LOS blocker (behind the door is another partition - doors leak LOS like windows).

That's it! Aside from a few more walls and touches that's what I had to do to get this map to work.

Now, back to work for me. I'll be touching up the details you've seen and hopefully reworking the lights.

After that's done...

Test time.

Thanks for your patience biggrin: